Revert Str / Dex Change

Have you seen Bart's comments?

 

the item team cannot publicly "HEY WHAT" because they are too busy nerf speedrun any% :doom:

 

Okay, what I will say is DO NOT CHANGE THE ITEMS. It's not the items causing stupid damage, it's the combo of dex and str. I'd say try to do something to make it so if you have both they're less effective.

 

Make it so strength doesnt apply if dex activates imo, just like def doesnt apply right now if agil activates. This would cap damage at 1.96x that of with no skill points, instead of 3.24x as it is right now. I agree with this for the most part.

 

It's not the combo. The combo doesn't help, but either alone is still stupidly strong. Removing the combo would just nerf ETW to a similar damage output as singly-offensive builds.

 

Looking at how builds have been effected, this is just wrong. Builds I have with dex or strength have gotten a slight increase in damage whereas ones with both have gotten close to 1.5-2 times damage. This is of course without building to use these changes.
Changing items will just ruin many builds and be too hard to get done quickly to try and solve a problem that isn't the issue of the items, but how damage is calculated.

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I might say go this way except use the higher stat, but overall making the stats less effective together I think would be better as you aren't just making one stat only useful for items and nothing else.

 

If anything this could just be an error in the code. I don't know exactly how damage calculation works, but if strength/dexterity were factored in for all forms of damage, we really shouldn't be seeing damage values hitting the integer limit. This change really should have been tested in a HB (after ONOL was released) before pushing.

 

Overall, I could see some recalculating and maybe reverting the change temporarily working as they try to balance the math, but with one of the stats alone it's mostly fine, maybe a bit of balance tweaking, but good to make glass on par with tank in the new update. The only problem is with the combination of str and dex, not with any items, they don't matter for the insane damage increase. I can attest to this looking at the before and after damage of my builds with all the ones with both str and dex getting mega buffed while ones with only one of those stats get a smaller buff that's far more reasonable.

 

I agree with the opinion of "Maybe we should give a balance patch to the item pool or something before pulling a change like this"
I'm not against this change, but this might be a bit game-breaking without a proper balance patch to accompany it

 

Okay, so I did some math with my builds. The lowest increase for a str and dex build I have is 30%, however, this seems to be an outlier as the second smallest I found was 50% dps increase. The highest dps increase I found without using both stats was 35% on a fatal build with 135 dex. For context, the 50% damage increase was a build with 20 str and 45 dex. Also the highest I've found in my builds for both str and dex in one build is 100% dps increase or double damage, an increase of about 3 times the max without using both stats.

 

Has anyone tried out the new damage numbers in TCC?

 

Someone did, yes.

 

mfw orphion delay as to not pressure the people working on it but str/dex changes immediately with only a few days of notice to pressure the item team into changing 40% of the items in the game as soon as possible

this isnt even about whether the change is good or not its about letting these people have a life
anyways knowing salted i highly doubt itll get reverted so whatever (and please prove me wrong for once)

 

more like 90% of items....

also, I thought we were trying to go away from rainbow sp slap ;-;

 

Really, trying to fix this by changing items is both way too much effort and unlikely to work due to things that I said here up above.

 

Honestly I’m not even against ETW doing this much damage. Except it’s not just ETW. Heavy melee inexplicably got buffed, even though it’s already a free pass for pretty much everything. Rainbow got buffed, so basically it has the tons of EHP it already had and now more DPS than any non-ET element combination. Specifically for the sake of ETW and ETA I do think STR and DEX should “stack”, but why they also had to make it multiplicative with %-damage is beyond me.

 

It would be fine if this just made glassy builds better, I agree, (though the stupid increase I would still disagree with). It's all a math problem though that we need to find a way to fix.

 

This is spot on and I'd like to add to it. Nerfing in games is 90% of the time not the answer ESPECIALLY when it is a mechanic problem rather than an item problem. When the elemental revamp shitshow happened most of the community was upset cause like almost all the items got nerfed or at least changed in negative ways and if every thunder or earth item gets nuked the same thing will happen just revert the damn change or at least heavily tone to down to maybe half the damage boost to make it much more resonable.

 

Thank you for seeing the point I'm making!

 

This was a necessary change. I do think raw melee items need a nerf, and rainbow has always needed a nerf, even more not that str and dex are more balanced.
But if you can take 1/25th the amount of damage if you build fire/air, you should be able to deal 25* damage if you build earth/dex.