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Buff Divzer (and Possibly Other Stuff Too)

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by _834, May 29, 2021.

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  1. _834

    _834 I forgot what I was gonna write in this box CHAMPION

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    Divzer has been through a lot over time, from base damage buffs to skill point bonus nerfs.
    Although much of the discussion of its most recent big change where it got a meaty -39 defence slapped on it, and I alongside most other people have just accepted it at this point, I feel like it should be changed up to better compete with the other mythic bows.

    Please note I'm not saying nerf the other mythic bows, I'm just saying to make the negatives Divzer has more manageable to make it a more viable option.

    I recently decided to take another look at my archer and tried to make a Divzer build, and I again realized just how restricting of a bow it is to work with. Because of the -39 defence and the completely ridiculous -550 agility, although you can technically use items with higher agility or defence, you don't get most of the survivability bonuses that come from the damage reduction % or dodge chance.
    This pretty much forces players to try and build a glass cannon that can do damn fine damage but dies in two hits, or sacrifice most of the damage you'd have for the tiniest bit of survivability aside from life steal.



    My main problem with this limiting Divzer users to extremely poor survivability is the fact that the other bows just don't do this.
    Only two of the other mythic bows have IDs that directly affect survivability, which is Stratiformis that has negative health and Grandmother which has some negative health regen.

    In the case of Stratiformis, the negative raw health ranges from -1400 to -2600, which may seem like a lot, and it is a considerable amount of health, but using the bow alone means you have guaranteed 140 agility which gives you a 78.2% dodge chance and that alone tends to invalidate the negative health, meanwhile it doesn't have any negatives in skills that prevent you from maximizing it's damage output or allowing you to make it even tankier with defence, completely invalidating the -2600 health.

    Grandmother has negative health regen, -350 to -650 raw and -21 to -39 %. This is harder to counteract than Strati's raw health but it can still be done without much trouble considering it has no negative skill point IDs as well. This is not even mentioning the fact for some reason it gives a whopping 70 agility without you needing a single agility skill point, drastically increasing your survivability with 51.3% dodge chance on a build you didn't even use points agility on.

    It's safe to say that none of the other mythic bows force players to sacrifice nearly as much survivability as Divzer does in its current state, but I guess that's the point? Big damage numbers at the cost of not being able to live?



    On to my second point. The idea of Divzer being to sacrifice survivability for damage is stupid. Although Divzer can pump out insane damage, it's not like other mythic bows can't compete. Just take Freedom as an example.

    Freedom is able to do comparable damage to Divzer that at times can even be higher, but Freedom's only drawback is that it requires a lot of skill points to be invested as it's a rainbow item. Matter of fact, Freedom even has survivability bonuses on top of its huge damage numbers, as for some reason it gives both 30 agility skill points and 300 to 1300 raw health. There is no reason Divzer should have such harsh negatives in order to prevent it from being as useful as something like Freedom.

    We can also look back at Grandmother again, and although unlike Freedom it has some IDs that impact your survivability negatively, and it can still pretty easily put out the same numbers as Divzer nowadays.

    Ignis is also a part of this. It can't do super-high damage comparable to Divzer or Freedom, it still can do pretty damn good damage, but actually gets the best survivability bonus out of all the mythic bows by a long shot with no negatives at all except the skill points it takes to hit the 105 defence requirement. As a fire mythic it has stupid survivability bonuses coming in with 15 to 78 % health regen, 150 to 650 raw health regen, 20 defence points, and 1200 to a whopping 5200 health. This isn't even including its major ID (I'll touch on this later). Clearly, Ignis has insane survivability while still being able to put out damage good enough to go through almost all the content in the game.



    The only other mythic bow with a negative skill point ID is Spring. The thing about Spring is that, unlike Divzer, none of its IDs affect survivability, with its only negatives being -50 dexterity and -35 to -65 % thunder damage. These negatives might affect damage, but as Spring is a water weapon mainly focused on using spells while also having a 20 strength point and 20 intelligence point bonus, these negatives don't tend to affect the damage as much as it seems they would, especially considering negative skill point IDs on weapons don't affect what armour and accessories you can use.



    Now it's about time I mention ETW. It is just flat-out a bad element combination in the current state of the game. ETW builds can never push out enough damage to be worth having the next to no survivability bonus.
    This is important for Divzer because it just isn't worth it to do any other element combinations, forcing it to deal with objectively the worst element combination performance-wise.
    As a whole, ETW as an element combination needs to be looked at again, with items that would be used for it needing some substantial changes.



    Onto my final topic I'll be bringing up, Divzer's performance in newer content. As mentioned multiple times earlier, Divzer can do amazing damage but has no survivability. This is a big problem with most newer content such as raids where there's a focus on long fights that rely on working as a team with everyone being able to both survive and do damage.

    In a raid such as The Canyon Colossus, sure using a Divzer may let you kill things there, but you just can't live. In the boss fight, you're vulnerable almost everywhere in the arena, and if you only have 20k EHP, you will surely die unless you are constantly standing by a mage that's healing you, but in order to stay with said mage, you might have to go in the range where the boss would almost instantly kill you.

    Forgery runs are a similar story to doing raids where there are a lot of ways for you to die, and that extra damage doesn't tend to be worth it, especially with how corrupted dungeons scale now.

    Looking at the other bows again, the drastically better survivability the other bows have and how they are all still able to do good damage lets them excel in this kind of content compared to Divzer, especially Ignis which has a major ID benefiting all nearby players' survivability as well.



    Although I have some suggestions for how to change the stats on Divzer, they aren't the most thought out and could use some tweaking.

    Suggestions for changes:
    - Possibly change the negative -39 defence to something a little more manageable such as -25 or -20 (or maybe even lower/removed completely)

    - Definitely change the -550 agility to something much more manageable, around -25 or -20 like my suggestion for the defence change (or maybe even lower/removed completely)

    - If either the agility ID or the defence ID was removed completely, I would be fine if the max life steal was lowered to around 900/4s from 1265/4s

    - Potentially lower the negative water and fire damages to allow players to use said damage types if they want

    - As well, negative raw health similar to Cataclysm could work as a replacement to preventing players from using agility and defence


    Again, don't take this as a suggestion to nerf the other mythic bows, all this is about is making Divzer more viable.
    Also, there are a couple of other items that just aren't as viable as their alternatives such as Gaia and I feel like they should be looked at too
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2021
  2. Bwitty03

    Bwitty03 Famous Adventurer HERO

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    isn't poor survivability one of the main characteristics of the thunder element?
     
  3. _834

    _834 I forgot what I was gonna write in this box CHAMPION

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    Kinda, but it shouldn't lock players in to using ETW, none of the other thunder mythics do this.
    As well, Cataclysm and Divzer are the only ones that have major survivability negatives, considering Cataclysm has -4200 to -7800 health. Only other thunder mythic with an ID that negatively affects survivability is Thrundacrack which has -42 to -79 % health regen
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
  4. Stormarend

    Stormarend The classes DO NOT correspond with the elements.

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    Not necessarily. Just ETW really. The problem is that TFA is just not doable with Divzer and TWF, while probably the best archetype to build with Divzer, is still painful due to -39 defence, which completely destroys your EHP. So basically you're locked into ETW or and incredibly nerfed TWF. While that may be intended, there's no question that ETW is just bad and TWF isn't great with Divzer either. Having poor survivability be its main gimmick would be more forgivable if low survivability builds weren't terrible. You can get the same DPS as Divzer with Grandmother with curse (and rage) and instead of your defensive skill points being gutted you get a free 70 agility. You can get more than three times the EHP of any Divzer build, while barely losing out on any damage. The damage-survivability trade-off is pretty much never worth it. You can plausibly live five times as long with Ignis and Freedom (ignoring health regeneration) while still doing 12k+ bombs.

    I would be on board with Divzer being super glass cannon, if being a glass cannon was actually good and even then Freedom and Grandmother get comparable damage with none of the downsides. Right now, you just get screwed by unavoidable attacks in ONOL or one shot in TCC. The game just isn't designed in a way where you can consistently succeed with glass cannon builds.
     
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