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Guide Defense And How It Affects Your Effective Hp

Discussion in 'Wynncraft' started by HIGHBREAD, Feb 27, 2020.

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  1. HIGHBREAD

    HIGHBREAD the earth thunder water man HERO

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    Effective hp is another method of evaluating the survivability of a build. To explain this with an example, we can see (using the graph above) that if I were to have 12,000 hp and 100 defense sp, my effective hp would be closer to a value of 34286--over double the original value.

    Due to how defense reduces damage, we can treat it as a rational function when increasing effective HP.

    effective hp = hp/(1-% of damage reduced)
    As the percent approaches a value of 1, the rate at which effective hp rises speeds up. As a result, even though the amount of % less damage taken you get per sp goes down as sp allocated goes up, the overall effect per sp actually increases as the amount allocated goes up.


    Now that the explanation is finished, here's the multiplier of hp for defense in increments of 10 sp.

    0 defense = x1.00
    10 defense = x1.10
    20 defense = x1.22
    30 defense = x1.35
    40 defense = x1.50
    50 defense = x1.66
    60 defense = x1.85
    70 defense = x2.05
    80 defense = x2.29
    90 defense = x2.55
    100 defense = x2.86
    110 defense = x3.19
    120 defense = x3.60
    130 defense = x4.05
    140 defense = x4.59
    150 defense = x5.21

    And here's another graph made by @LegionGlory which gives a visual representation of it (in percents).
    Fire_2.png


    Note: True damage bypasses defense (eye laser), so it's important to keep that in mind.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2020
  2. Kiocifer

    Kiocifer Creator of salteďpog3 and other monstrosities VIP+ Modeler

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  3. LegionGlory

    LegionGlory Travelled Adventurer

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  4. btdmaster

    btdmaster Famous Adventurer

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    Finally someone explains why def doesn't have diminishing returns unlike what some people think
     
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  5. HV_Metal

    HV_Metal Collapse will reign VIP

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    Me: has 102,116 hp
     
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  6. Crokee

    Crokee Regularly stabs The Eye HERO

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    And this is exactly the reason why I prefer tank archer now.
     
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  7. Jirayut

    Jirayut strati masterrace VIP+

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    someone dy/dx that equation and see the growth curve... so we could see if it's linear or what growth
     
  8. TheMinceraftian

    TheMinceraftian Well-Known Adventurer

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    But you can literally say the exact same thing about agility, with the returns actually increasing the more points you invest.
     
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  9. HIGHBREAD

    HIGHBREAD the earth thunder water man HERO

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    it's
    a rational equation
     
  10. Linnyflower

    Linnyflower Unmodified Avatar HERO

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  11. Dondasch

    Dondasch Hadal gaming HERO

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  12. MegaCoquin

    MegaCoquin Formerly known as NPCGrian HERO

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    Like highbread said, it’s rational, so the derivative will be rational

    My class isn’t doing anything rn so might as well

    Take derivative of both sides with respect to % of damage reduced
    d(ehp)/d%=(0*(1-%))-(hp*(-1))/(1-%)^2
    dh/d%=hp/(1-%)^2

    If we wanna find the max rate of change(where your hp would be increasing the fastest as you put more percent in), you could do more calculus but that’s boring, just plug it into a graph site, and you can see that effective hp zooms off to infinity as you approach 100% damage reduced(which is x=1 in this case because percent is in decimal form), which makes sense bc if you had 100% damage reduction you would have infinite health.

    So this is all redundant because I am restating what the thread is saying but math is fun

    (Assuming %damage reduced as a function of def pts doesn’t just become zero as def becomes really large)

    Is there a dedicated function used for %damage reduced as a function of def pts?
     
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  13. Crokee

    Crokee Regularly stabs The Eye HERO

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    Sure, but rng sucks sometimes. In addition, defense allows time for the player to heal as the player knows they are taking damage instead of say with agility where the player will still be at full hp even while taking damage and then suddenly gets 2-shotted or something along those lines.

    One thing I found out was that agility is more effective at low hp amounts and defense is more effective at high hp amounts. For example, The Perfect Run vs. tank statue. Perhaps anyone would like to tackle at what hp amount would be the critical cutoff point on whether to use defense or agility?
     
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  14. TheMinceraftian

    TheMinceraftian Well-Known Adventurer

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    No such thing. The defense and agility both function completely independently from HP.
    It’s just the archetypes that make it appear that way. The thing that is abundantly clear is that specialization is key, which is an important juxtaposition of strength and dexterity, which actually work better when mixed together about 50%/50%
     
  15. Druser

    Druser ele defs don't matter HERO

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    The specialization margin for mixing versus specialized Def/Agi is extremely tiny, essentially negligible. I ran the calculations on this as one of my earliest forum threads.
     
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