Champion Is Pretty Fair And Should Be In The Game - Change My Mind

Champion is not pay to win. Many champions have stated Pet Tasks aren't a huge deal, and I've already proven the bomb bell isn't a huge deal either because if a Champion wanted to be in a bomb party they would've been notified of it anyways, sometimes earlier.

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Fair point. I guess they changed their stance on it/needed more money.

 

Never criticized you for making inflammatory posts, I actually think those can be good for the community, I criticized you for calling the post "change my mind" when you're not willing to change your mind. I read what you said, the only time you conceded any points was when you started making pedantic arguments about the definition of what pay to win actually means.

I never disputed that Champion made money, but the question is how much. There aren't that many people with the rank, even if 500 people (which is a liberal estimate) bought it, that's $160 per person for a total of $80 000, except for the fact that most of those people upgraded from Hero, so really you need to half that to $40 000, remove paypal fees of about 3% and any other fees associated with sales like currency conversion (30 cents CAD for me, more for other countries) and you're starting to cut into that a little more. Pretending like those fees don't exist, that money isn't going to last very long, Hypixel's costs are unknown, but are estimated to be over a million USD per year, Wynn is a lot smaller, so it's fairly safe to assume their costs aren't anywhere near that, but it's still safe to say that 40K isn't going to be keeping the server alive for years to come, it'll probably be gone in the next couple months. My point about champion is that it isn't sustainable, if they wanted to buy new server hardware, it might have been a good way to raise funds, but it isn't something that's going to keep bringing money in like other things could. a

As for speaking on behalf of all Champion rank owners, I specifically went out of my way to say that I wasn't, I have no idea how you possibly could think I was. "Not saying everyone feels the same as me" and "I would say" are both very clear ways of saying that I'm speaking on my own behalf. You're also guilty of doing exactly what you accused me of doing when you said "People will be more motivated to keep playing the game when they've committed and bought champion". You should probably stop projecting onto what I wrote.

Finally, I also made it very clear that I wasn't commenting on if it was fair or not, I was criticizing your reasons for champion staying. I could not care less if it's fair or not, I play Wynn as a single player game, my issue is with how terrible your reasoning is. None of your three points have any reasoning or proof to support them, if you're going to make intentionally inflammatory posts at least try to put in the minimum effort and actually make a cohesive case grounded in reality for why you think it's good.

 

You have a lot of good points. Champion probably isn't bringing in that much money, but at least the dev team is getting something out of it. This wasn't an intentionally inflammatory post either, I'm just very confused on why everyone around me seems to be complaining about Champion.
Fair point. You're speaking for yourself, got it.
I made this post because a lot of people said that Champion negatively affects the game, but I couldn't see why so I made this post. I see why people might think it doesn't have a lot of benefits, but I don't see harms in it either.

 

All of that is irrelevant though, again, I'm not here because I disagree that champion is bad or pay to win, I'm here because your entire argument hinges on extremely flawed arguments with no or almost no basis. I'm asking is you do a better job of representing your arguments by bring up facts to support your points, that's all.

 

I don't think Champion shouldn't exist, but I do think that the way it's currently implemented is flawed and allows bomb lobbies to be heavily favoured towards Champion players.

They could always rework things like the champion slots (which would solve a ton of issues I personally have with the rank), and they could always rework the bomb bell to something more fair, like perhaps you could have a /findbombs <bomb type> command, which you could use maybe like 5 times a day or something (if you don't find any of the bombs you are looking for, it doesn't count).

 

You have a point, it's changed

I agree with you, they should change the bomb bell delay to around 10 minutes or so or maybe more, or they could implement another idea.

 

Pet Tasks are unfair.
The bomb bell makes the experience for non-champion players less enjoyable because bomb servers are always full.
The Build Stand is Champion only. That sucks.
Its so annoying to pm people with a nickname.

Champion is p2w. It makes Wynncraft as a game worse and I'm very dissapoited. I beleaved in the admins and devs. This game exists because of the community. To have a p2w rank is disrespectful to all supporters.

@JaydonTheWarrior explained it. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to copy paste something.

f*ck Champion

 

Flora and other people have stated that pet tasks are not nearly as significant as people think, and I see that neither of us are champion
I've already explained about the bomb bell: Most dedicated bomb parties ping players within a few seconds of bombs dropping, and if a champion genuinely wants to be in such a party they can give themselves the role on discords. However, private parties still exist, but these only have around 20 or so people in them, usually not enough to fill a server. The slot thing is a bug that needs to be fixed.
The build stand saves you what, like 30 seconds of time? That's not nearly enough to be deemed "p2w"
You can literally hover over their nicknames to see their real name or use the reply shortcut command, you're not gonna be messaging 3 nicked champions every minute.

In conclusion, I don't think you've brought up a lot of good arguments on why it's p2w. You can still play as an unranked person and have 99% of the same experience you would get without champion being in the game. You do not need to "pay to win".

 

"The pet tasks are not as significant as people think"

- that doesnt change the fact that they are unfair. I dont care how much of a p2w feature they are, because everyone can see that everyone without them has a disadvantage.

"I've already explained about the bomb bell: Most dedicated bomb parties ping players within a few seconds of bombs dropping, and if a champion genuinely wants to be in such a party they can give themselves the role on discords. However, private parties still exist, but these only have around 20 or so people in them, usually not enough to fill a server."

- that also doesnt change the fact that they are unfair. When I was a new player I had no friends on wynn and no guild. I didnt know about bomb parties or discords. The only way to get to a bomb server was to be there first or follow a shout. Thanks to the bomb bell thats harder now. Also all of your argument doesnt change the fact that it is a unfair and payed feature.

"The slot thing is a bug that needs to be fixed."

- I didnt say anything about that. The bomb servers are more often full (regardless of the bug), because of the bomb bell.

"The build stand saves you what, like 30 seconds of time? That's not nearly enough to be deemed "p2w". "

- I didnt say it is p2w. I said it sucks.

"You can literally hover over their nicknames to see their real name or use the reply shortcut command, you're not gonna be messaging 3 nicked champions every minute."

- I can, but its still annoying. Especially for people who recruit for guilds for example.




"In conclusion, I don't think you've brought up a lot of good arguments on why it's p2w. You can still play as an unranked person and have 99% of the same experience you would get without champion being in the game. You do not need to "pay to win"."

In conclusion, I don't think you've brought up a lot of good arguments on why it's NOT p2w.

Also try housing without a rank. Thats 100% not the same experience. Its disappointing to say the least. Lootrunning without champion is not the same either. That also goes for professions because you always know where the bombs are.

 

If it's not significant, it's technically unfair but not significant enough to warrant change

You cannot use the argument "they might not know about it" and you know exactly why. Knowledge is not p2w, people can tell them such discords exist, and they probably will find out about it if they really need bombs this bad. It also isn't unfair. Champions paid a lot of money to get this, it is 100% fair.

"It's still annoying" is not enough to warrant a change and call it unfair. This costs you around 3 seconds of your time, if you're playing wynn you do not need those 3 seconds that badly.

Even though it should be extended, there is still a slight delay in the bomb bell and most servers ping within seconds of a bomb dropping. In 1.19, the server would be full within 5 seconds at any rate, with or without champion.

It sucks is nowhere near a large enough argument to warrant a change or deem it unfair, neither is it backed up or explained. Swapping a build takes 15 seconds.

Housing does not affect gameplay. And how does it affect lootrunning? And at any rate, you will "always know where the bombs are" if you've given yourself the role on the discord for the bombs.
You make lots of arguments with little backing and use vague words like "that sucks" and "it's annoying", so I really don't understand what you're saying.

 

As someone who likes housing, I have noticed a few problems with Buildstands being locked behind champion. Now, I am ONLY speaking on behalf of myself just so no one gets confused but I like collecting pieces and sets of armour that I think are cool; whether that be because of lore like Bob's battle chest piece of because they are sets like Champion or just quest helmets, like the breathing and climbing helmets, etc. Now as someone who isn't champion, all of this rubbish belongs in my bank. Bank pages are expensive, especially for someone such as myself who doesn't have more than half a stack of LE, build stands on the other hand cost 4 LE each (I think) and that price doesn;'t go up when you buy more - at least I don't think it does since it doesn't do that for other NPCS (I bought 2 blacksmiths)

Buildstands can hold 8 Peices of gear since they can hold accessories too. That means that Champion players could buy more buildstands to hold stuff which would otherwise go into the bank. This would mean they are much cheaper since you wouldn't have need to put any peiece of armour, rings, braclets or necklases into the bank, which, atleast for me, would save loads of space. Whether this counts as pay to win, i don't know but I get the impression it is much cheaper which could be deemed as unfair.

Also another note, I do not know if you can have an unlimited amount of bank pages or not but if you can then buildstands offer more storage to champions.

 

Half a stack of LE gets you 13 bank pages. each bank page has around 45 slots iirc. An armor stand has 8 slots and can only store 1 of each type of equipment. Half a stack of le would get you 64 slots for 4 of each type of item, compared to buying bank pages which would give you 13 times 45 slots of storage.

 

For the first 13.
After that it's extremely expensive

 

Bank pages seem to exponentially increase in price from my understanding and experience, Buildstands don't. Eventually it just becomes more cost effective to use build stands to store and display the armour.

 

2 stx of emeralds gets you 16 bank pages, more than enough for everything you could possibly need. In comparison, 2 stx would only get you 32 armor stands.

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read above

 

You'd be surprised. I'm not on wynn atm but I'll run you through my bank pages from what I can remember.

Page 1: General stuff (money, quest helmets, LI tokens and few different weapons I use for my different classes, runes) - quite full

Page 2: Powders (+ a handful of ingredients since they can't fit anywhere else) full

Page 3: Tools (These I keep since they are worth a bit and I may need to profession level another class) full

Page 4: Materials (mostly spares from past levels though stockpiles for future levels + also in case i need to level professions again) - full

Page 5: Scrolls (I have a collection of every single city scroll and a lot of dungeon scrolls, I have a large stockpile just in case + it's a cool collection) - full

Page 6: More Materials (same thing as 4) - full

Page 7: Ingredients (also a stockpile for professions, like 4 and 6) - full

Page 8: Cool peices of armour and weapons - full

Page 9: Dungeon stuff (keys, shards and the special drops e.g. eye's pupil) - full

Page 10: More amour bits - alot of these are fabled because I think it's cool) -mostly full

Page 11: Overflow ingredients (space ran out on 7) - 3/4 full

Page 12: More materials because overflow (I really am trying to use them all up) - nearly full

Page 13: lore stuff (Bob's letters among other bits like my siegfried collection because why not, as well as more armour) - 3/4 full

page 14: Recently bought ( probably more ingredients in the future) - 1/4 full.

Now, my bank is a tip, I know that but since the materials and ingredients keep growing cause i just dump evervything in my pouch every half an hour, freeing up 8, 10 and bits of 13 would be brilliant and much cheaper than buying another page and besides build stands look cool and would also encourage people to use the housing since they could build cool displays - that's what i wanted to do since I didn't know they were locked behind champion or it wasn't revealed.

Maybe I'm doing profs wrong but using ingredients certainly seems to boost my xp but if there are other less 'cluttering' ways to do it I'm all ears

 

That's not true, though? for you, personally, it might be enough, but I know a lot of people with all 21 and still don't feel like they have enough. I have 19 personally, and nearly every slot full with relevant items, nothing really I could throw away at the turn of a hat.
reason I haven't bought more is because it's like 45 le for the next page lol

 

The discord isn't nearly as reliable as having a system in-game that actually tells you where the bombs are.

The discord relies on someone actually going on there and pinging the bombs, which also relies on you having discord open, and for in-demand bombs, like prof bombs, by the time someone has posted the ping, a good percentage of the time it's already full.

 

The maximum number bank pages you can buy is 20, thus you'll have 21 (as the first one is free). I am not sure how many armour stands can one person own, but assuming it's unlimited, their number is limited by the maximum stands you can place on your island, which is quite a lot.

"Bleh, who's gonna fill all their 21 bank pages?!"
Guess what, I did manage to!

 

You have to remember that armor stands cost 4 LE for 8 slots, meaning you are paying 32 EB for a single slot of storage. And if you need to store 7 helmets, you need to buy 7 armor stands. That's far too inefficient to be an unfair advantage.

It'd be already full without champion, bomb lobbies fill up in around 5 seconds in 1.19. Although I do agree with you the delay should be extended, it's still not significant enough to be an unfair advantage. Also remember that you don't need bombs to survive.