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The short & sweet Paladin rework

Discussion in 'General Suggestions' started by _Rippi, Sep 12, 2024.

?

Do you agree to these changes?

  1. TES

    3 vote(s)
    42.9%
  2. partially (at least 50% of changes)

    4 vote(s)
    57.1%
  3. NO NO NO

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    Why is there no balancing/rework prefix?? deus can you ask plz most suggestions here are balancing/reworking things

    Welcome readers to the short and sweet paladin rework, where i propose paladin changes that would make the class more fun, more enjoyable, more towards what it advertises and also mentioning things that are currently broken (in a bad, bad way) about paladin.

    First off, ever since 2.1 , paladin provoke (and by extension +taunt) doesn't work on most mobs (as they just ignore it and go after another player) or bosses (i can't taunt the boss as a tank class, sadge), mythril skin... doesn't provide knockback immunity, because most mobs ignore that, and sacred surge can be activated during spells, wasting the charge. mentioned in a feedback post.

    Now for actual changes:
    • Mantle of the Bovemist (MoB):
      Mantle has a long cooldown, so to make it feel consistent without just making the cooldown shorter (which should be done if you want quick fix), MoB regenerates mantles every 3 seconds, so you would be able to tank more hits as long as you dodge some so you don't lose all mantles (also the wording with the charges kinda suck, also its still called shield by Wynncraft.

    • Provoke: Make provoke into +taunt and give it warscream mana cost red... everyone says that provoke sucks bc its outclassed by a necklace. as for items with taunt, make them increase the new provoke's range to double.

    • Sacred Surge (SS): This one is wow. Thunder conversion on Paladin is berry weird, and with a cherry on top. SS and all other abilities that had thunder conversions have fire conversions. Now, SS should be casted on main attack with a cooldown, and if we want to reward the paladin for tanking hits, you should get more SS % per hit taken (1%). makes

    • Shield Strike (SS2): This is one of the thunder dmg ones. Also, since you can probably get 16 mantles at max, you would think that 1600% damage is a lot, but its hard to achieve and paladins don't have many big damage tools, and sparkling hope is better for consistent damage, speaking of...

    • Sparkling Hope (SH): Its another one of those thunder conversions, to fire. Its fine in general, but you basically want this over SS2 because of SS charging with healing now. So apart from the damage it gives make it deal a big burst every 100% of you hp you healed, the percent can be 200%, not too much of a bust, but makes it more sparkly

    • Second Chance (SC): First off, rename this to Holy Tether (HT) because dungeons have a second chance. Now this HT is an upgraded version of SC, Because you can shift + uppercut to apply to the player closest to you / in front of you a holy tether, that lasts as for 1 minute, until one of the 2 players is dead and for casting it on another player), but has no cooldown and can be applied any time you shift + uppercut.

      This HT gives you and the tethered target benefits, such as: The paladin receives 20% of the damage you would take, any buffs the paladin casts and applies to self is also applied to the ally (courage, Ragnarök, Radiance), but also gives them mantles that can't regen (if the target is a paladin you can stack them, but up to 10 mantles per person at the same time... otherwise would be impractical but funny 80 mantles).

      Now the important part: Holy tether makes both the user and the target to use second chance revive ability. This was, paladin can finally become the bodyguard.

    • Martyr: This one's cool, but should be activated when anyone in you party dies. not just you
    The comment section exists, so write there what you think its good/ Bad

    also i lied, this was not short
     
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  2. Elytry

    Elytry Currently Spiralling (depression) VIP

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    game mechanics
    report these as bugs
    im confused
    does this require casting war scream
    does this require at least one mantle active
    is there a max duration
    also please tell me how this isn't overpowered
    an MID having the same niche as an ability (that doesn't work well) makes no sense, yes
    mantle kinda does this already because +1% for shield broken, but i could see that.
    main attack COULD be a trigger, but it should stay on bash and upppercut
    also fire conversions make sense yes
    wait how do you get 16 mantles? aspect?
    also you just mentioned a problem and did not give me an answer thumbs down
    i don't know much about this one since i never used it (palamonk moment)
    yes
    but
    it needs another player (main weakness)
    i don't like the second chance part with the revive, though. (second weakness)
    also martyr may or may not be possible.
     
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  3. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    they are either already rreported or ct already knows about the issues
    Its as long as you have 1 mantle and as long as you didn't get hit for 3 seconds, so you still have to dodge. and with this you can get a maximum of 16 mantles (t3 paladin mythic + 25 seconds of mantle regen after breaking 7 in a second). and the max duration still stays the same
    ^^
    Well, that's the neat part. Paladin is a tank class, it supposed to tank (aka take hits) for others, and that others are teammates. If paladins in lootruns make little sense (since why use the class that tanks and is slow in the lootrun activity), so having paladin be... useable in the other modes. Having a way to help a low ehp teammate is very nice, since they usually die by a one shot. Also the mantles fact is important, since along with the 20% redirection base + guardian, anyone can stay alive (as long as they don't get hit too many times).
    also second chance is that one of many nodes that does... smth not useful for paladin (keeping it alive when their allies are dying) so sharing it would be good :)
    And also if you don't have other teammates, don't play pure paladin... you can and should always crosspath.
    As in? its simple, if a party member recieves a killing blow, characters in the 12 blocks radius get invulnerability for 3 seconds. its just that simple, yet is good to not make everyone die at the same time from a big attack.

    Also thanks for the feedback :D
     
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  4. Elytry

    Elytry Currently Spiralling (depression) VIP

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    just making you aware that no ability in the game interacts with your party so it may or may not be possible
    okay maybe
    see this is where i disagree
    archetypes should be able to completely function solo, even if (like Lightbender) having allies enhances their strengths.
     
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  5. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    I believe paladin solo will be strong enough, as they'll get an overall dmg boost from the fire confersion changes, and in lootruns, paladins can ignore defensive boons. Also if you like damage as paladin, cross path with the other archetypes.

    And its called an mmo :)
     
  6. Elytry

    Elytry Currently Spiralling (depression) VIP

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    i mean, i'm confident it would be viable, BUT: an archetypes mechanics SHOULD NOT rely on other players in general. I'm fine if they perform better with others (Lightbender), but there shouldn't be any gimmicks that literally require other players.
    The singular tank archetype should not be reliant on other players when the two HEALER archetypes are completely self-sufficient in gameplay and game design
     
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  7. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    why should a character that relies on buffing other players NOT have a mechanix that buffs other players? you would still have the basic second chance solo, and have the ability to help teamates if you want.
     
  8. BabaFisi

    BabaFisi The Rifted Jack-of-All-Trades CHAMPION

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    I think that your Holy Tether idea for multiple players is cool, but still a little too basic in solo.

    It’s just a revive for an archetype that is already tanky enough to survive practically anything.

    I think you should get some sort of buff upon getting revived yourself. Like, maybe getting the buff from Radiance for 5 minutes instead of like 2 seconds.
     
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  9. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    first off, radiance lasts 8 seconds, and with t2 empowering fantasy aspect its 11.5 seconds, quite a lot...
    secondly, where do you have this? We don't want holy tether to have yugioh card text (+it would make holy tether require radiance, making ut harder to have early), im not replacing martyr, the other 2 nodes above second chance are also shared to fallen...

    I could see this as a t3 paladin mythic, but that would mean that other mythics need a similar end game effect, and im not capable of doing that for the other classes.

    And as for other buffs, what kind of buff could paladin get after reviving? the only noteworthy buff is like, radiance, so youd have to create a new buff instead.

    Actually scrap that, ignore the martyr suggestion of applying to all allies, instead it applies to only yourself recieving a death blow, and it also gives the radiance buff for however long ct wants.

    I realized martyr triggering on party members is... op for wars. and war paladins already have radiance soooo good idea haha :)
     
  10. Elytry

    Elytry Currently Spiralling (depression) VIP

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    it can buff other players, it just should be able to function solo (fortitude, the acolyte totem buff, ragnorakkr, and radiance are all examples)
     
  11. _Rippi

    _Rippi V.I.P. (Varis is Perfect) I LOVE REVOLVER VIP

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    So the only buff i see is that you can apply 5/7/8 mantles to yourself to stack up to 10/14/16? the others are damage redirection, buff apply from any distance and a second life that still exists.

    Also to edit: the applied mantles will only be applied once you cast warscream with the mantles, since the way i worded it you can apply mantles infinitely...