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Game Design "Geyser Pit" Boss Altar

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by Stonefriend, Jan 17, 2024.

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  1. Stonefriend

    Stonefriend Well-Known Adventurer HERO

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    The bosses invincible phase is way too long and currently cant be sped up, for example dealing damage seems to have no effect on time spent in the phase. It seems to take a random amount of time (~2-6mins)

    Basically:
    -> Enter the bossfight
    -> Kill phase 1 in one milisecond
    -> Wait while running in circles and randomly get hit by the minions every once in a while.
    -> Get annoyed about the occasional pull/push spell
    -> Wait some more
    -> Kill phase 3 in one nanosecond
    -> Collect the loot
    -> Repeat
     
    point_line likes this.
  2. Deusphage

    Deusphage gruesome grue Modeler CHAMPION Builder

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    Creator Karma:
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    I believe that is the point
     
  3. Stonefriend

    Stonefriend Well-Known Adventurer HERO

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    I think so too but I also think its a bad point. Its not fun to run around in a circle for a minute.
    Im also especially triggered because i rolled ~25 Summas before I finally got some decent ones with 8/8 mr.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2024
  4. xihuanchirenrou

    xihuanchirenrou Well-Known Adventurer HERO

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    Yeah, Orange Cybel for example has a similar exploding mechanic like this, but there I'm fine with it, since the boss can keep you closer to it (smaller arena) which reduces the time it takes to explode (At least I think so, I saw a message or two about this at some point and people on the internet never lie, right?) However, the Geyser Pit boss has a huge arena which might end up with newer or less experienced players (with the boss) running away for what seems like an eternity and keeping the boss from exploding faster. Also I swear this one has a longer timer.

    Also, the Geyser Pit boss is pretty much only fought for the Summa drop (not even guaranteed lol), and the drops are given immediately after the relatively boring walking simulator, while Cybel is the penultimate fight of a "difficult" boss rush (still fun and can be difficult if bad or new to LI) that gives access to multiple useful accessories, while Summa is just one ring whose stats can vary, which while not a bad thing inherently (I love item identification system), can be a slap in the face if you roll a bad one (or two or three or 25) after spending that much time walking around. At least Legendary Island can be engaging with some bosses, especially on certain archetypes. Hmelee Shadestepper makes LI very fun for me personally.

    Keeping the exploding phase is fine, as long as it is shortened and the other two phases are more interesting somehow. I don't remember if geyser attacks exist in the boss, and I know the geyser pit is more supposed to be about the area you farm the resources to use the altar, but something relating to geysers would be nice. Also what's the point of the bots in the ground, I swear they do nothing.
     
    trex1611 and Stonefriend like this.
  5. strikeflame5356

    strikeflame5356 what do I write here VIP

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    It sounds like you're expecting absolutely no effort to have to be made to beat this boss. The invincible phase was (probably) designed with the assumption that the player would have some level of investment in the fight and be engaging with the mechanics etc., making the phase fun. If that investment and engagement is lacking that means the fight has colossally failed at doing what a boss fight (and all "gameplay" in general) is supposed to do. This may be because the fight has lacking mechanics or its mechanics are bad, because it is poorly balanced, or because the player is trying to cheese it, or all of the above, as seems to be the case here. Outside of maybe some strange avant-garde game design strategy (maybe wynncraft should look into that) you usually shouldn't be designing a phase of a boss under the assumption that one of those 3 things will be the situation the boss is fought in, since you usually don't plan according to the assumption that you will mostly fail at what you are trying to achieve.
    If you are trying to grind this altar for a bulk supply of perfect mana roll Summas, understand that you're using the altar for what is probably not its intended purpose, and that is why it is doing things that are not helpful to you. I've fought this boss a few times at level 95 on a build that doesn't oneshot everything, and it seems pretty fun, and I've heard it is quite fun, in the way it is meant to be.
    If you believe that in addition to serving the needs of level 95 players who want a cool boss to fight while they're in Corkus, it should also be serving the needs of endgame players that want to grind Summas in bulk, I think you should clearly state that case (I would probably then argue with you about that) but when you don't do that it makes you sound like you just don't know how the game works or something.
    (which wouldn't necessarily be your fault)
     
    Stonefriend likes this.
  6. Stonefriend

    Stonefriend Well-Known Adventurer HERO

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    No a bossfight taking effort is fine. Its just that it takes none currently, you just run around for minutes which isnt fun. Even at level its not fun. Players are gonna try to find and use the optimal strategy for your boss, thats how people work, and if the optimal strategy is to just run around in a circle until the phase ends, you have failed at designing the bossfight in a fun way.

    A way to make it more fun for example could be this:
    Make the underground maze-like area for minions an actual maze where the player has to guide something through and reward them with a shorter invincible phase
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2024
    trex1611 likes this.
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