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Game Mechanics Friends On The Other Side - A Summoner Remake Proposal

Discussion in 'General Suggestions' started by ThePurpleEmerald, Aug 13, 2023.

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ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Ilikedogs said: ↑

Srry mb for not reading the entire thing in the first post.

I didn't see the part where invigorating wave becomes a universal node for every class lol.

Now since shepherd is removed, I have 1 more suggestion that could fit in this some sort of AOE capabilities.

Looking at how trapper's rework switched the places of archetypes in the tree, you might as well just switch the place of ritualist with acolyte, because ritualist's mask changing ability conflicts with the original bull whip or your latcher ability. Then move the regeneration node from the ritualist tree into like one of the first upgrades on the ritualist tree, right below one of the spell unlocks.

Now with summoner and acolyte being close together, I see more AOE capabilities as summoners can take the opportunity to take some aura upgrades from the acolyte tree.

As well as adding a replacement to a final red node ability in replace shepherd, which I have an idea for AOE capabilities:

An ability that buffs aura by sacrificing all summons that currently exists, creating a super strong aura, giving players options to decide if they want all of their summons out dealing constant dps, or clear a big group of mobs instantly with the minions built up.
If this is in consideration, I suggest putting this into shift + aura and putting the sleeping dream dweller into normal aura input, just in case players cast the wrong spell.
The ability should be something like this:

(Placeholder name)

Aura does 50 percent of player dps, every summon being sacrificed adds on 30 percent dps to this blast.

An example calculation: Should be around 5 (effigies) + 5 (puppets) + 3 (voodolls) + 1 (dream dweller) + about 6 (latchers)

20 * 30 percent is 600 adding 50 percent dps, thats how much for a nuke like clearing AOE ability. Players need to wait and resummon everything which is like probably 8-10 seconds before they could use this ability with full potential again, and also accept the fact that they just lost all of their constant dps (minions) temporarily.

Additionally:

For balancing issues, sacrificing latchers will be only adding 10 percent dps onto the aura because how fast players could potentially spawn them, don't mind my calculation above there.

Maybe even needing sacrificial shrine as a node at first, just for the theme. (scratch this)

About some thoughts on latchers and dream dwellers:

change latchers into pure buff/debuff summons, and change dream dwellers into pure crowd control/ healing
Starting from explaining latchers:
What I mean this in detail, is to rework latchers to become a summon that "steals stats"

When you uproot an enemy, it latches on the enemy, debuffs it identically to your original latcher design, what is different is that it transfers the debuffs on the mobs, into buffs that benefits the player, for example when you uproot an enemy one of the stats latchers "steals" is walkspeed, then what is stolen becomes a buff to the summoner player, lets say -10 percent walkspeed for the enemy, +10 percent walkspeed for the summoner. Once the latchers despawn, the buffs decay away as the stats returns back to the enemy. This ability's buffing potential will get really hot when a group of enemies gets latched on.

Going on to the dream dwellers:
Explaining the dream dweller healing and crowd control:
By default, there will be this dream dweller is sleeping state, in this state, it provides extra health regen for the summoner player, quite simple right?

Once a summoner player is hit while the sleeping state is active, the dream dweller wakes up because someone just beated their master. It makes enemies within the radius of lets say 8 blocks "asleep" for 3 seconds, in this state, enemies cannot move (-100 percent ws, just like your reworked nature jolt), and bosses are obviously going to be immune to this ofc, this ability has a 4 second cooldown (starting the cooldown after the 3 second duration of the "asleep" ended), and once dream dweller casts this sleeping ability, it immediately falls back to sleep again, back to giving the summoner player extra health regeneration.

As to why I thought about changing latchers and dream dwellers, is because the abilities feels just more dream dweller ish ( don't judge me, its just my opinion and i didn't make the post), because I just thought it wouldn't make sense for a sleeping themed summon to be tied with damage buffs, and feels more right if it made enemies "asleep". Making a unique crowd control ability for summoner different to ritualist (groups enemies together with aura), acolyte (killing everything with rather high aura damage lmao, also every acolyte in their right mind takes that ritualist node because its so free), by "stunning" enemies is quite interesting as well. By putting the original buffing role of the dream dweller onto latchers also makes more use of latchers, and people could use it more other than that single use for debuffing enemies.

Having AOE capabilities doesn't nessecarily mean needing extra AOE damage, but also some crowd control yk (auras always there). :D
Click to expand...

I’ll reply to everything else later but did you not read the

“but as for the general AOE capabilities, I don't want the Crowd Control to rival Acolyte, but I also don't want it to be completely single-target either”

part of the post

I don’t want summoner to have the funny big AOE I just want it to have some AOE

But still I appreciate the sacrifice suggestion, really sounds like something a Shaman would do

ThePurpleEmerald, Aug 19, 2023

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Ilikedogs Skilled Adventurer HERO

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Alright got that but please do consider my suggestions on switching the place of ritualist with acolyte and moving regeneration down to one of the first abilities a shaman player gets.

Ilikedogs, Aug 20, 2023

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Grugle RotS Enthusiast. HERO

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As a fellow purple enthusiast, your suggestions are always a delight to see.
(Also, is it just me, or do the dream dwellers MC model remind me of something from PokeCA?)

Grugle, Aug 20, 2023

#43
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Grugle said: ↑

As a fellow purple enthusiast, your suggestions are always a delight to see.
(Also, is it just me, or do the dream dwellers MC model remind me of something from PokeCA?)
Click to expand...

Idk what that is but you can see the QnA for more details on their design inspiration

ThePurpleEmerald, Aug 20, 2023

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Grugle RotS Enthusiast. HERO

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ThePurpleEmerald said: ↑

Idk what that is but you can see the QnA for more details on their design inspiration
Click to expand...

Look up Pokémon Cobalt and Amethyst. It’s amazing; genuinely one of the most impressive feats—in Minecraft—of all time.

Grugle, Aug 21, 2023

#45
Da Homeboi scream at me if somethings wrong with the wiki HERO

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There's not enough friends, here's a bump to join their group.

Da Homeboi, Aug 28, 2023

#46
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Ilikedogs said: ↑

Srry mb for not reading the entire thing in the first post.

I didn't see the part where invigorating wave becomes a universal node for every class lol.

Now since shepherd is removed, I have 1 more suggestion that could fit in this some sort of AOE capabilities.

Looking at how trapper's rework switched the places of archetypes in the tree, you might as well just switch the place of ritualist with acolyte, because ritualist's mask changing ability conflicts with the original bull whip or your latcher ability. Then move the regeneration node from the ritualist tree into like one of the first upgrades on the ritualist tree, right below one of the spell unlocks.

Now with summoner and acolyte being close together, I see more AOE capabilities as summoners can take the opportunity to take some aura upgrades from the acolyte tree.

As well as adding a replacement to a final red node ability in replace shepherd, which I have an idea for AOE capabilities:

An ability that buffs aura by sacrificing all summons that currently exists, creating a super strong aura, giving players options to decide if they want all of their summons out dealing constant dps, or clear a big group of mobs instantly with the minions built up.
If this is in consideration, I suggest putting this into shift + aura and putting the sleeping dream dweller into normal aura input, just in case players cast the wrong spell.
The ability should be something like this:

(Placeholder name)

Aura does 50 percent of player dps, every summon being sacrificed adds on 30 percent dps to this blast.

An example calculation: Should be around 5 (effigies) + 5 (puppets) + 3 (voodolls) + 1 (dream dweller) + about 6 (latchers)

20 * 30 percent is 600 adding 50 percent dps, thats how much for a nuke like clearing AOE ability. Players need to wait and resummon everything which is like probably 8-10 seconds before they could use this ability with full potential again, and also accept the fact that they just lost all of their constant dps (minions) temporarily.

Additionally:

For balancing issues, sacrificing latchers will be only adding 10 percent dps onto the aura because how fast players could potentially spawn them, don't mind my calculation above there.

Maybe even needing sacrificial shrine as a node at first, just for the theme. (scratch this)

About some thoughts on latchers and dream dwellers:

change latchers into pure buff/debuff summons, and change dream dwellers into pure crowd control/ healing
Starting from explaining latchers:
What I mean this in detail, is to rework latchers to become a summon that "steals stats"

When you uproot an enemy, it latches on the enemy, debuffs it identically to your original latcher design, what is different is that it transfers the debuffs on the mobs, into buffs that benefits the player, for example when you uproot an enemy one of the stats latchers "steals" is walkspeed, then what is stolen becomes a buff to the summoner player, lets say -10 percent walkspeed for the enemy, +10 percent walkspeed for the summoner. Once the latchers despawn, the buffs decay away as the stats returns back to the enemy. This ability's buffing potential will get really hot when a group of enemies gets latched on.

Going on to the dream dwellers:
Explaining the dream dweller healing and crowd control:
By default, there will be this dream dweller is sleeping state, in this state, it provides extra health regen for the summoner player, quite simple right?

Once a summoner player is hit while the sleeping state is active, the dream dweller wakes up because someone just beated their master. It makes enemies within the radius of lets say 8 blocks "asleep" for 3 seconds, in this state, enemies cannot move (-100 percent ws, just like your reworked nature jolt), and bosses are obviously going to be immune to this ofc, this ability has a 4 second cooldown (starting the cooldown after the 3 second duration of the "asleep" ended), and once dream dweller casts this sleeping ability, it immediately falls back to sleep again, back to giving the summoner player extra health regeneration.

As to why I thought about changing latchers and dream dwellers, is because the abilities feels just more dream dweller ish ( don't judge me, its just my opinion and i didn't make the post), because I just thought it wouldn't make sense for a sleeping themed summon to be tied with damage buffs, and feels more right if it made enemies "asleep". Making a unique crowd control ability for summoner different to ritualist (groups enemies together with aura), acolyte (killing everything with rather high aura damage lmao, also every acolyte in their right mind takes that ritualist node because its so free), by "stunning" enemies is quite interesting as well. By putting the original buffing role of the dream dweller onto latchers also makes more use of latchers, and people could use it more other than that single use for debuffing enemies.

Having AOE capabilities doesn't nessecarily mean needing extra AOE damage, but also some crowd control yk (auras always there). :D
Click to expand...

Ah crap forgot about this okay here we go

I have a bit of resistance on switching the places of archetypes on the tree and in turn completely changing the arrangement of all the nodes, I'll probably leave that to someone else if they want to take up that challenge (Also because I don't usually go back to a past project when I'm finished, I'm working on other big stuff now lol)

I agree with the Totem Regeneration needing to be more accessible at an earlier level, but again read previous message

Not too fond of the concept of the minion sacrificing, tbh
Barring the fact that I'm not sure about Summoner having a Burst Damage playstyle option, the act of removing all your minions even for a short time kinda also goes against the concept of Summoner's "constant maintenance" gimmick a little. Kinda makes it more of a "Build-up and then unleash everything at once" sort of thing

It is an additional perfectly functional option but not necessarily a fitting one
(Also also for the AOE thing, see previous reply)

As for the hitting mechanic, doesn't this encourage the player to take sacrificial damage in order to trigger this? I was under the impression that Shaman (especially Summoner) probably isn't the tankiest thing in the world, and getting hit even once would not be in their best interests, especially when their AOE isn't as good compared to the other archetypes.

I probably missed something in your really long reply but I'm rushing this a bit atm I'm a little busy with other stuff so feel free to point them out whenever thx

ThePurpleEmerald, Aug 29, 2023

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Ilikedogs Skilled Adventurer HERO

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All good bro.

About the dream dweller activates crowd control ability, it doesn't encourage players taking damage, its more of like a "fail save" thing that has a cooldown, the point of this ability is to prevent players from getting overwhelmed by crowds because summoner lacks crowd control (the ritualist aura upgrade that pulls mobs together node is kinda far from summoner's tree), and gets instantly melted, this ability gives players the chance to quickly move out of that sticky situation, and make safe distance.

I don't like that sacrificing minion thing either, it was just a random thing that came up to my mind, it feels like some based node ct team decides to add for summoner and acolyte hybrids. Summoner and acolyte hybrids are bad as well because triple totem and sacrificial shrine just means suiciding. I hope there are exclusive upgrade nodes made for hybrid builds that comes along the fruma update, but thats just too much CT development time.

I'll see if I can help with anything of the arrangement of skill tree.

Ilikedogs, Aug 31, 2023

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Blast_craft Skilled Adventurer HERO

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How did you manage to create your own Wynncraft Ability Tree?

Blast_craft, Aug 31, 2023

#49
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Blast_craft said: ↑

How did you manage to create your own Wynncraft Ability Tree?
Click to expand...

I just grabbed the nodes in singleplayer and then arranged them in a random double chest

ThePurpleEmerald, Aug 31, 2023

#50
Blast_craft Skilled Adventurer HERO

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ThePurpleEmerald said: ↑

I just grabbed the nodes in singleplayer and then arranged them in a random double chest
Click to expand...

huh, actual effort. thanks 'bout that. Because I am in high school and want to do something during my breaks. but that sounds like something I can't really do here.

Last edited: Sep 1, 2023

Blast_craft, Sep 1, 2023

#51
Tealy a businessman of sorts GM CHAMPION

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SkyrimConjurer said: ↑

Wyyyncraft if you read this PLEASE dont add this and rework the Summoner otherwise it would be totatly destroyed.

Please if you add those ability change the minions or remove sheppart its never going to be the same

Summoner got already nerfs after nerfs it doesnt need any other changes anymore.

And this change would be a heavy nerf
Click to expand...

what is blud blatherin about

Tealy, Sep 8, 2023

#52
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Tealy said: ↑

what is blud blatherin about
Click to expand...

They haven't logged on since sending the message after that one

Probably just haven't seen it yet

ThePurpleEmerald, Sep 8, 2023

#53
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Bumping this because the Summons are like pets and I want Panic Zealot pet

ThePurpleEmerald, Sep 16, 2023

#54

ineedhelp, Elytry, Elysium_ and 1 other person like this.
Elytry Fractal VIP

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ThePurpleEmerald said: ↑

Bumping this because the Summons are like pets and I want Panic Zealot pet
Click to expand...

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes PANIC yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes PANIC yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes PANIC yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes
PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC YOU CAN'T STOP PANICKING ITS CAUGHT YOU AND YOU'RE TRAPPED AND YOU'RE GOING TO DIE PANIC PANIC PANIC THEY'RE EVERYWHERE AND NOW YOU CAN'T SEE PANIC PANIC PANIC PANIC

Elytry, Sep 16, 2023

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Blast_craft Skilled Adventurer HERO

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I have a question, I asked once how to make your own ability tree, I have successfully done that part, but I am missing something. How do you fix the durability?

Blast_craft, Sep 29, 2023

#56
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Blast_craft said: ↑

I have a question, I asked once how to make your own ability tree, I have successfully done that part, but I am missing something. How do you fix the durability?
View attachment 189667
Click to expand...

Make it unbreakable

ThePurpleEmerald, Sep 30, 2023

#57
Blast_craft Skilled Adventurer HERO

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I might be dumb or something, but the only thing I found out is to get the server pack from Wynncraft and transfer it into a texture pack, then changing the code in the pack itself so it doesn't have a durability bar.

Blast_craft, Oct 1, 2023

#58
ThePurpleEmerald Famous Adventurer

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Blast_craft said: ↑

I might be dumb or something, but the only thing I found out is to get the server pack from Wynncraft and transfer it into a texture pack, then changing the code in the pack itself so it doesn't have a durability bar.
Click to expand...

I just said, literally make the item unbreakable.

ThePurpleEmerald, Oct 1, 2023

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TntTheJester Local Jester HERO

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Bumping bc this should be included in some way or form to improve summoner gameplay drastically

TntTheJester, Oct 7, 2023

#60

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