Game Mechanics Remove CCI

CCI is being used as a crutch to fix a lackluster boss system.

You wouldn't really need CCI if all spells (barring special bosses like raids or dungeons) didn't come from the boss itself. For example, the blood rune mechanic in Orphion's boss fight is an example of an attack from the boss that doesn't directly come from the boss itself. If more bosses had attacks like these that force the player to react, then CCI wouldn't be necessary because players wouldn't be constantly attacking bosses anyway. An assassin player can't go in for spin attack abuse if they're too busy dodging attacks. The game is not hard because there is just a lack of boss attack options.

I really liked how Wynncon did their bosses. They had basically event attacks where the player was forced to react no matter what. They made bosses more engaging and feel more like a threat rather than a damage sponge. Attacks from the boss that put pressure on the player would really help.

 

Orange Lily being too strong has everything to do with CCI, as evidenced by the fact that it was only considered competitive but balanced pre-1.20. It hasn't really changed in 1.20, it's just that Arrow Shield has become much less useful so Olily not having Arrow Shield is much less of a drawback.

As for Shaman, I'm pretty sure this is a widely held community view, but I could do a poll if you want.

 

It was most certainly NOT considered "competitive but balanced" pre-1.20. Even before CCI people were saying that it was busted. It's 100% my Virtuoso

 

I agree with this.
Orange Lily is broken as hell.
If you made it go from a legendary to a mythic, I would still think it deserves a nerf XD

 

What exactly is so bad about orange lily then? Last time I played I knew it was one of the better bows in the game, but I didn’t hear that it was broken per se.

 

high base damage, -3 spell cost on bombs = less int sp needed = more into dmg/ehp, can fully abuse one of the two op powder specials (curse), has +2/5s mana regen, not roll dependent, cheap to get, untradable (useful for cheap hunted builds), basically it's just an absolute shitshow of a bow that outshines literally any other option (cluster is supposed to come in second for non-mythics, but even that is hilariously outdone by olily)

 

I guess I'm gonna be the only person on Wynn to have this opinion, but I love CCI, I even loved it in its first form. Wait, I actually loved it more in its first form (seriously). It made Warrior so much better for me because I didn't have to worry about upper-canceling because it was finally done for me and it was so comfortable.

But before anyone assumes that I have this opinion simply because I play Warrior, then no. I basically did the entire playthrough of Wynn with each class with the original CCI implemented.

(By entire playthrough I mean all quests and some extras like LI and EO (well EO obviously since I did AHC))

And not once did I feel like CCI was a huge problem with any class. Even Shaman felt absolutely playable and normal and I even tried TCC with Shaman and didn't have any issues. (I should also note that all my classes and builds focus on spells and not melee)

With Mage it was barely noticeable as Ice Snake's CC is already like 1 sec, so whatever.

To be honest, I didn't really play Assassin in the endgame before CCI, so I don't know the difference here, but Assassin with CCI definitely didn't feel weak to me.

Warrior is just superior with CCI

Shaman is just fine.

Archer is probably where I noticed it the most when my arrow shield didn't knock up enemies, but still not something I would complain about.

So my super unpopular opinion here: Keep CCI and even feel free to revert it to its former stage lol.

 

Can't we just have an in-between?

Instead of timed KB resistance: % based kb resistance. e.g. a boss takes 90% less kb from attacks. This way arrow shield still deals kb, just considerably less.

Instead of timed debuff resistance: % based debuff resistance. e.g. a boss is only 50% affected by slowness -> if slowness is -40% speed, it turns into -20% speed.

Instead of timed blind resistance: ...Actually we can keep that, stunlocking is overpowered and I don't need it back. I don't think that needs explaining.

I guess this hasn't been implemented because it's hard to code? I don't see any immediate problems with this method

 

sustainedKnockback is a stat I've referred to more than once in the past, and practically every spell at this point just ignores it. it was something I complained about for years without success

 

You have? I've never heard of this.

 

(this post is entirely about CCI for Shaman, as it's the class I started with, and I started in 1.20 so I've dealt with cci the whole time after the point where it becomes common, and the only other high level class i have is mage which just doesn't die and AAAAAAAAA can you make this class more boring )

Difficulty in Wynn is only really present if you don't try to cheese it with a highly defensive build (or skill pots or some other things), so whether CCI is good for the game cannot be judged on whether you can play the game using highly defensive builds. Also, Shaman is very clearly meant to be able to, theoretically, dodge all or almost all attacks, given its low base defence and intended "high skill" playstyle, which really doesn't exist for Shaman unless you have to dodge hits. Therefore whether CCI is good (for Shaman) should be judged on whether one can no-hit or at least no-hit ignoring chip damage.

And it's pretty clear it's absurdly difficult to do this against many bosses, at least without doing something like placing the totem, running away, and fighting the boss entirely with totem damage, which doesn't count as it is wildly inefficient. You mentioned somewhere that all your builds were WFA or WA, at least before the 1.20.3 changes, so it's pretty clear you haven't attempted something like, say, ETW shaman LI.



That being said, Shaman without CCI does get boring, as I know from the enemies without CCI in level 54 to level whenever almost every boss gets CCI, but that doesn't mean CCI is OK. Shaman needs to change (not only because of CCI but other issues, maybe I'll post a suggestion on that; I have some interesting ideas), and CCI needs to either be balanced around by the Shaman changes, balanced around with better boss mechanics, or changed/removed.

 

I never considered my Shaman build to be highly defensive, it has 12k HP and around 53k EHP, which is lower than what all my other builds on different classes used to have. Sure it has defence, but I don't think it's based around survivability and super high def

About the second thing... While it's true that I've never tried ETW Shaman and it's also true that most of my builds were WFA or WA, my Shaman never was, my Shaman was and is ETFA. Which has that Defence as I said, but I don't think it had higher survivability than any of my WFA builds before the patch.