Game Mechanics Many ways to improve Wynn

I've played dozens of games, some of which are good, some are bad, and anything between.
When playing Wynn, I feel extremely frustrated due to some flaws and issues.
And please, allows me to describe what they're and how to fix it.


1. Enemy Design


In current state of Wynn, they deal way too much damage and having high health pool as well.
Some have insane walk speed with high knockback resistance to enforce you back-walk all the ways, or
some would fly around the skies with their nonstop warrior's dash or mage's teleport to move your camera like crazy and even lags to exceed memory overhead.
Now to think, why Wynn made such designs, I tried to follow the thought process behind.
In Warframe, they have similar issues, and there's a history of it.
Many games give the player an ability to Crowd Control (aka CC) enemies by performing certain actions.
Warframe's case it was skills and spells in Wynn.
It raises a problem where players can just CC enemies for good or at least during portions of gameplay, even at where it meant to be challenging, making the game utterly easy to beat, ruining end-game experience.
To fix such issues, many developers decided to make enemies tankier, more damaging, and much more.
Giving fast walk speed is one of them, to makes you hard distance.
Giving high damage / health is also one of them, to makes you hard to kill or even survive.
But with the power of CC, these are often meaningless, due to its nature.
So, developers made challenging mobs immune to CC, cause why not?
And even so, tanky players are basically immortal, and to punish them many raises damage higher, and higher. Now the problem is, such decision punishes glass-cannon real hard, sometimes at even unplayable level. Because people will eventually find one way or another, the damage keeps increasing, so the only choice is to move on and starts to have some survivability.
There are games that glass-cannon builds are very viable, and it was possible thanks to damage-ignore mechanics, such as dodge, block, parrying, deflects, and much more.
Players may dodge / block / etc on reaction by following animations carefully, and animations indeed play major role in video games.
(I'm a dedicated For Honor player, so if you have any argument on this, I can speak all day long why your wrong and animations are very much-needed.)
However, it wasn't a case for Wynn.
Even Minecraft has animations where skeletons draw their bow, ghasts open their mouth, blazes render flame effects around, etc. Despite Minecraft having blocky models and texture, these small details made player possible to react.
Wynn however, ranged mobs rapidly shoot projectiles with extreme velocity infinitely without any motion, mobs like CoW just forces you to tank all the damage and kill it fast before it kills you, mobs in LI fly around to lag you and even makes the combat boring, raids enforces you to have extreme EHP just to survive yet still demands enough DPS to snuff out enemies quickly, and much more!
Following are my humble ideas to fix some issues I adressed.

1. Keeps back-walking should never be a thing in video games, it's just microtransaction, unnecessary.
(To fix this, Walk Speed and Knockback Resistance should have some ratio, so enemies with fast speed should have rather negative knockback resistance whereas slow enemies have increased knockback resistance.)
2. Players should be able to react / read ranged attacks.
(To fix this, If an attack is unreactable, let them have big cooldown after rapid shots, else longer the delay between each shots or slow down projectile speed.)
3. Enemies should not enforce players to have above and beyond EHP just to survive
(To fix this, just tune values)
4. Because Wynn have no manual gameplay mechanics to ignore damage completely besides moving around to avoid hits, glass-cannon builds are very punished.
(To fix this, provide else ways to enhance survivability. Health Regen is not just viable unless Guardian, Life Steal is also very underwhelming unless your attack speed is Super Slow. Given glass-cannon is thunder element's nature, upon critical hit, let any attacks proc life steal guaranteed. Worring about these thunder builds quickly regenerating their health like crazy? Minds you makes healing exclusive to potions and mage's heal is not a good game design at all.)


2. Heavy Melee


When my long been friend @YYGAMER seduced me to play Wynn again, telling me heavy melee is arrived truly got me, but upen seeing it I can already tell it's trash. So for those of you who don't know what Heavy Melee is, it's a reference to builds that are focusing around high main attack neutral damage and use Quakes to deal lethal damage every so often. First time I heard the term Heavy Melee, I was thinking of builds with slow attack speed, yet each hit is deadly enough to even match up for tier stacks, but in reality just Quake spams, in return you got no options but to powder your weapon with earth. Any build shouldn't lock behind a certain ELEMENT at all.


3. Items with Stats Bonuses


Interesting design I must say, whilst it opens up creativity, but also causes frustrations when Item Makers made changes on items. Because most of the time, players must look for replacements to make their build works again, or even worse, rebuild from scratch. Normally, it's understandable to receive some sort of rewards for adjusting items that are in use, however Wynn never once did. I indeed admit it will be hard to rewards players, but if so, when an item's released, all its stats should be FINAL. Of course, balancing might come necessarily, and that's where inconvenience begins, right? No, it wouldn't be a thing, if stats bonuses don't affect gear requirements in the first place just as weapon / consumable would do and if item requirements were final. It's just a mess of game design, after all.


4. Spell Favourism


Item Makers are obviously favouring spells over melee by giving melee items less health, negative defense and all sorts of downsides but complete opposite to spell items. I ain't got much word on this, because it's undeniable, and sure IMs knows how to patch it - they just don't.


Many thanks, Sombian.

 

No, it's hard to balance, not bad game design.
Items requiring skill points, and items having skill points that affect what you can wear, is what single-handled makes the build system so interesting.
The requirements are what forces players to find creative solutions, while also being a thing that allows for such a diverse item pool.

 

Like I said, it may opens up creativity but also causes frustration.
Some may loves the moment of struggles to fix their build, some may not.
Its about preference I guess, but for me, I believe makes stats bonuses on armours / accessories don't affect requirements
and makes every requirements final should be enough for players to find their creativity without frustration.
A whole balancing in items will be required of course, but at the end of the day, it's much healthier for future updates.

 

Ah yes lets make 90% of the mythics completely unusable because you can't get over 100 sp without bonuses
If skill point bonuses didn't affect requirements everything would be in even more disarray than it apparently seems to you
Class building is really fine as it is, and requirements/bonuses are a huge part of how it works

 

You didn't get me. Of course, existing items' stats requirements should be reviewed if its done. After that, why would IMs make mythics unusable by setting their stats requirements beyond manual assign limits? You just greatly missed the point out here.

 

this is a pain to read, but im bored and wont need my eyes in the upcoming week soooo

compelling argument, I don't know if this opening statement is meant to prove you are right, but if it is then let me tell you I have over a thousand hours on Team Fortress 2, which makes my opinions on Wynncraft always right

thats why were here.

yea some of the skins are outdated, altho ill have to say some of the mobs are insane looking!

oh wait not that kind of design...

yea, I died 12 times to weak zombies just by stepping outside of Ragni as lvl 106

hint: provide examples.

unique mobs that are most of the time exclusives to a quest/dungeon or are rare mobs :D

I havent seen anyone able to dish out 20 spins in a row at lvl 40, but yea I guess stuns are pretty good

and the 1.20 update was added to the game, cause why not? and players are getting banned for duping, cause why not? its not just a "cause why not?"

idk man, im pretty sure even on divzer's glassy af builds u can 1 shot mobs around SE and survive atleast 1 hit, just dont stand there immobile like you're an IGN game journalist playing DOOM. Also your build sucks if it only focuses on having the highest dmg possible and plays solo, no wonder you'd get 1 shot in the hardest of quests/dungeons

agility. its better than what you think and YES some insane dps builds use air

no indeed, thats why there's a distinc sound and particles when mobs are about to spell, thats why there is now a warning when a guild tower is about to aura/volley (along with the dragon scream, fire bubbles and meteor like particles falling), thats why there's a chat warning when the wretches are advancing from the back of the room, etc.

cool, 3 examples of places where soloing is not reccomended! CoW is a boss that isn't a piece of cake to solo at lvl, LI is a reccomended group effort (also afaik the only flying mobs in LI would be in Yahya's part, where you dont have to fight them), raids enforces you to play as a team just to survive, yet still demands enough DPS that can be covered with raid bonus

+10 points, added an adjective to your ideas, which is very good in an argumentative text

just run in circle lmfao

also wtf does it have to do with predatory money making method costing childrens over the world millions a year?

thats already the case in many areas.

@Crokee EO solo naked with -15 hp?
also whats wrong with having a designated tank player in a T E A M?

yet again forgetting agi and how good it is.

hpr is very viable

ls is very viable with powder specials

it would make super fast proc ls every second, kinda OP :D

yet again forgetting: ignis's maj ID, food, crafted scrolls, rally, shaman's totems (hi abso trift, I miss u), greed and im sure myself am forgeting other ways to heal yourself that aint just mage healing and pots (which are ofc the most viable)

oh noooo, you played a build for 2 min and can tell its trash :(

im not sure what you tried to write here

I wouldnt call a quake every 10ish seconds a "spam"

yea, instead everyone should use common gears so nobody would have elements.!

bro, 99% of builds are done around a certain element(s)

any game with items like that are prone to balance, its part of the game

yea, thats called adapting your builds towards the new metas..?

finally I can agree with you! I too would like to obtain a stx of LE every item patch because I used a lvl 23 item that was nerfed once in my lifetime :D

ok, they just won't release any new items

no, because then nobody would play cause the meta would have been stale for 7 ish years with no new items released

ok lets remove all armor if "its just a mess of a game design, after all"

again @Crokee would be happy to poke the eye naked

we live in a society where melee items are treated unfairly, rise and shine meleers (and atleast put some deo pls)

well that was quite the read, ty.

 

Beautiful

 

man be spittin straight facts

 

Before I start counterpoint yours... spliting each sentences / sections and nitpicking about it or even mock at doesn't do anything.
To prove it, I'll do the same.

You've choice to not read but you decided, consequence is yours.

Totally unnecessary script, but you did the effort, and I appriciate it :)

+Effort

Mocking doesn't counterpoint anything like I said above, unless you're dumb enough to anger by little shits.
Also I write this whole script with people who reading this have some pre-experience and background of Wynn in mind, you may think of highly damaging mobs easily, again, unless you're dumb.

Which considered as main challange no doubt.
When game's core challange is consist of these mobs, that's a problem.

Yet another mocking, but I can do the same!
Are you a fan of being unable to do anything but keep getting punch in the face and still be happy?
Given you don't give shits about getting stun'd, quite masochistic and pervert I must say.
Not to mention, shame on you, for being lewd sir.

You started to nitpicking simple phrases, "cause why not?"
Normal person won't do such, yet you did, "cause why not?"

If only attacks were reactable and even so, getting one-shotted is never a good thing.
Moving around constanstly won't do the magic, it may works, but on occassion, unless fast walk speed, agility, etc.

Having survival stats should not be essential for end-game contents, being creative is Wynn's one of the greatest strength, and it completely locks you out of it.
Not to mention agility is RNG based, making so unstable, unlike mechanics I listed above, as they're totally stable with right hands and dexterity.

Sound may only hint player a little, a whole animation is a lot better.
Because you dare made any statement against why animations are so precious in video games, here are some examples of what distinct animations can.

I'll be adding moves' speed in ms but because CCU (Core Combat Update) hid first 100ms of any moves' animation and indicator, visible duration is not moves' actual speed. For example, 500ms move will only visible for 400ms, keep this in mind.



Tiandi, the only vanguard of Wu-Lin has a palm strike that confirms a light attack on land.
Because how little the animation is, despite being 600ms (0.6 second), it is considerablely one of the hardest bash to dodge on reaction in FH community.



Kyoshin, the latest hero as well as the 3rd hybrid of Samurai has 500ms (0.5 second) bash that confirms a light,
but because how extremely distinct the animation is, it's very easy to dodge on reaction.
Even after Koyshin received buff on miss recoveries (previously missed kick could lead yourself getting guard broken), as animation still makes it easy to dodge, it's nowhere to be good as Tiandi's palm strike.

Now the list goes on, but to save my time, I won't list anymore of it at this time, hope you get enough ideas why obvious animations are very visble and reactable but little animations aren't.

You mentioned particles or sounds before spell cast, but spell isn't the only attack enemies can.
Melee or nomal attacks if you will are the problems.
It's partially my fault to not describe it but here we are.

Soloing is not recommended isn't the problem.
Yes they're meant to be challenging, meant to be complete by group of people but alone, but its not difficulty I'm talking about, the design. The current way how Wynn made it challenge is unhealthy.
And when I mentioned flying mobs, I was refering to Robob, Cybel, etc where they basically airborne for good using spells after another, back and forth, makes you to move your camera even in F5 third person view.
As for the radis, bonuses are highly effective and are strong, but many actually choose Giant over anything as it's near impossible to survive without them, where it shouldn't.

+Effort

Run in circle is obviously the same...only the trajectory differs.
And are you the kind of person who's loving these mircotransactions?
If so you can make thousands of money if you do Loading & Unloading.
(You actually get paied well but requires strength / endurance so better prepared!)

I've no idea about the second sentence but hey, I'll take it with grain of salt.

Sure, some have quite a delay between each shots, but I was not talkin about these...
Honestly you should know that not I was not talking about these unless trying to nitpicking.
It feels like you're only trying to brings up the unlike examples.

Because enemies don't only attacks the TANK in your T E A M.
Yes there's a major ID that redirects damage to nearby allies but it's not enough.

Health regen could be viable if enemies don't hit you so hard, or if the value was even higher.
Right now regen is pretty underwhelming due to the delays between each, whereas mage could just patch your wounds from bottom to top within matter of seconds, potions can too, life steal works better if a player hits multiple enemies at once, the list goes on.

Life steal have some potential but fast weapons have no chance of even getting close to slow weapons,
because after a spell cast, with slow weapon you may just land a hit and still lucky enough to proc life steal,
whereas fast weapons, after a spell cast, must land multiple hits, at sacrifice of your DPS, and may barely able to proc life steal. This is why bracelet [Atlas] has it's use.

Yet another nitpicking, my choice of the word "exclusive" may raise such misconfusion but still.
I listed two, as they're the most efficient...

As for my idea of let critical hits proc life steal, the reason was most glass cannon builds can actually survive one or two hits (perhaps more, it depends), but the problem is unless mage, or even as a mage, you'll be taking most time healing yourself and strike few more hits, then patch your wounds again, it cycle.
Not to mention you'll loses DPS as well as having high chance getting feinted with few hits, in result dealing less damage with less EHP. These all can be solved if life steal procs on crits. May sounds overpowered but because they have so little EHP it's nowhere to be tanky as EHP monsters. Rainbow build will be super overpowered if then, but IMs can just adjust stats, giving them no life steal or whatever.

This is just assuming no doubt.
You may think, my script is also have nitpickings.
Consequences...

It was what I imagined when I heard Heavy Melee, hope it cleared out.

A perspective it seems. I am calling it "spam" cause it's the main damage source of Heavy Melee,
where in my opinion it should be slow melee attacks that deals enough damage to tied up with tierstacks.

Repeated statement but, Wynn's one of the greatest strength is creativity, and locking behind it completely ruins it. Earth / Thunder / Water / Fire / Air can all tier stack, can all spell spam, etc but only Earth can Heavy Melee, and that's the point.

If only it result balancing in items but it often breaks your build.

Adjusting values that are not related to requirements are FINE, and that's indeed balancing.
Breaking builds by changing stats bonuses aren't, it's also a balancing too, but it BREAKS build, make it unusable. Sure you may find replacement, but no doubt it frustrate.

Yet another mock on me, but hey, judging by your statement, you seems you're the kind of person
who'd be total fine if Microsoft / Apple brick your PC under the cause get rids of legacy and still be happy, no complains at all, truly proud of you.

"But brick someone's PC isn't just balancing it, but making it total useless"

You may replace some of PC parts and then it will run as it used to, so go on find your replacements I guess.
Extra budget or not, they should not rewards you right?

Yet another mock, I already gave up counting, anyways that can also be a solution too, good point.

Not only balancing in stats / requirements changes the meta, and its funny to see how you split my statements in sections and pretend they don't connect to each others yet yours.

No idea how you ended up with that conclusion, but okay then.

Same here, that was quite the read, ty.
Hope you never split sections like this ever again, its not only poor way to claim statements, but also barely means nothing most of the time.

 

There’s a reason why everyone’s liking his post and not yours
Hate to break it to you, your points suck and I don’t need an essay to prove it to you, I think @99loulou999 has that covered for me lmao

 

uhhh
uhhhhh
https://wynndata.tk/gen/stats/99loulou999.png

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i think some pre-experience is the understatememnt of the century

 

Sure you dont need an essay to prove I'm wrong but at least reasons, and I did counterpoint @99loulou999's.
If you think my counterpoints don't make sense, that's where you provides reasons why it's wrong.
This is discussion, not just because someone counterpointed me once, I'm all done.

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Thank for you correcting me.

That was obviously mocking as he did the same and pulled off the most unlike examples.

Mine also contains humours I believe, if your script criticizing me was humour for you.

 

Maybe add a poll? Then we can see how revolutionary these ideas are

 

That can indicate how people like / dislike my ideas but for me it's important to know what people think of current Wynn and why my ideas are bad.

 

Before we start I don't wanna come of as rude, but i have a right to my opini9n and ill try not to pull a dwicey but this post genuinely makes me angry. SO ocelot if u read this plz dont mute me just ask me to edit this post. Lets begin

Thats soo cool I also play tons of other games like Ark, Titanfall 2, Apex, friggin golf with friends. This does not make me credible with Wynn since "being good at game" is not equal to "i have learned and studied a game to know how it works and why it does. Just because a baker can make bread doesn't make him a bomb defusal expert. sorry try this again :)

Yes as many other people do too. Keep in mind this is MINECRAFT not its own custom game. The fact that Wynncraft exists the way it does is an absolute godtier achievement to minecraft's flexibility as a agme and to the CT for making an outstating server. If you have an issue, ask ppl for help. If you have a bug, make a report.

oh god here it is.
Yes during BOSSFIGHTS you will find this. Otherwise mobs are actually low dmg AND low hp. they use swarm tactics to make the player feel powerful bc they kill alot of mobs quickly.
Raids also have this, but keep in mind that they designed to be like that because its a CHALLANGE. If the game was easy we would all have mythics and the economy would be trash......o wait.....

Yes, these are s p e l l c o m b o s. crazy how bosses have special moves too! I thought that was a player only feature!

Yup!! This was an issue for a while! Especially after shaman was released! CC was an extremly powerful game mechanic that did indeed cause alot of hard fights to just be "abuse game mechanic and win"

are you fuckin shitting me rn? so like what was the sentence you just said? "...even at where it meant to be challenging, making the game utterly easy to beat, ruining end-game experience" You are just contradicting yourself now. First learn to make a proper argument so you dont give people headaches. CCI was created because OF THE EXACT REASON YOU JUST STATED. While making this post did your brain restart randomly from overheating like the GPU in LI? lmaooooo

"tanky players are basically immortal" Errrrt wrong. Go play TCC with a healbot mage they get 1shot even 2 runs. Ive seen em and been them.
"and to punish them many raises damage higher, and higher" also wrong. Many ways tanky players are nerfed is with debuffs, slowness, -hpr, -mr, etc. Tanky players designed their builds around the raid. not the other way around.

hm? I play fatal. A waerker hp mythic depending on ur build, yes its mage BUT 20k ehp means u still get boned easy AND fatals +Healspell cost means healing is alot harder. Yes i still have full tomes at 40 raids completed with a fatal mage. Ive seen Divzer mains beat the monkey snot out of TCC and not die. What?

again what? So with spells you are aware that they give particle effects AND a sound to give you a heads up? or did you not look into that?

No? CoW teaches you that movement is important in combat and to be aware of your surroundings + your stats. CoW teaches that not every boss is the same and that you may need help beating it OR you need to use a different approach. Please look into things before you make these claims

Mobs in LI are LITTERALY BOSSES. SPECIAL CASES, ofc they are gonna fly around and be hard to be its called Legendary challenge for a reason?????. How does it make the combat boring? Most people see the challenge as the fun part. Raid give you HP, so i dont wanna hear it. Also it gives you DPS bonus. From my experience with Collapse and aftershock players have too much dps since the current raid speedrun is 30 seconds.

Im not even gonna talk about the rest of this post since i dont wanna break any rules and crap on the OP. But dude research and look into things before you make a post. It will help you AND it will make you look like you know what your talking about. Thanks for reading but im not gonna talk anymore as im quite pissed from having to disect a poorly constructed argument today. See ya o/

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@99loulou999 dude you are my new idol ty for posting <3

 

Well, guess you didn't see my comment.
Your opinion shares many thought with @99loulou999's, and I don't want to waste my time repeat same answer again, see my comment above.

 

Based

 

well this is getting a bit too heated for a forum post ngl
EDIT: I have no offence on any of you just in case that you were mad at me for some weird reason

 

i wanna make this into a phoenix wright parody but theres too much text and its not really direct back and forth-

 

yeah sorry for getting heated my guy xD

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mmmmm do it anyways, free meme content