World Thunder Mythic Bow

Although Az is capable of doing tons of damage with the correct build, it has been nerfed several times base damage wise-- compensated with an extra powder slot though, and people view it as the worst archer mythic (It's lv. 74 though .-.). So I've created an end-game thunder mythic bow, please give any helpful suggestions and do not say "overpowered", "broken", "weak lol" without a reason to as why you think that, and again, leave any suggestions that you think would make this bow better without being pre-nerf cataclysm.

Incessant Echoes

Super Fast Attack Speed

Neutral Damage: 120-230
Thunder Damage: 100-250

Class Req: Archer/Hunter
Level: 99
Strength Min: 10
Dexterity Min: 110


(IDs are base values that are multiplied by 1.3 for max and 0.3 for min.
Negative values are still multiplied by 1.3 for max, but multiplied by 0.7 instead for min.)
Thunder Damage: 12
Dexterity: 15
Strength: 3
Poison: 1800
Reflection: 15
Health: -2750
Mana Regen: -2
Defense: -10
Intelligence: -10

[0/2] Powder Slots
Mythic Item

The arrows fired from this bow travel at speeds of light, with surging electricity coursing through the arrows that invigorate them. Before the enemy knows it, the arrows have already hit and electrified them over a few seconds and only the loud constant echo of thunder remains in the air.

Changelog In Chronological Order:
+ Very Fast to Super Fast
+ Added poison/3s
- Reduced max thunder damage by 130 (WAY too much damage at 85-400)
- Reduced thunder % damage (too much damage)
- Removed walk % speed & agility req
+ Added Strength req (for poison)
+ Added negative health bonus (less of a low risk bow)
- Reverted back to Very Fast Attack Speed instead of Super Fast (t00 much damage)
+ Added negative mana regen (-1/4 to -4/4 | CHANGED to -1/4 to -3/4)
+ Added negative Defense & Intelligence skill point bonus (-20 to -11 on both)
+ Increased minimum thunder damage by 10
- Removed % Spell & Melee damage
+ Reduced Defense & Intelligence skill point bonus (now -13 to -7 instead of -20 to -11)
+ Increased Earth % damage (now -39% to -21% instead of -104% to -56%)
- As suggested, removed 3 negative IDs & reverted strength requirement

• Removed negative earth % damage
• Removed negative earth % defense
• Removed negative water % damage
• Removed strength requirement.

+ Increased negative values due to removal of 3 negative IDs

• Health bonus now (-3575 to -1925) from (-2925 to -1575)

+ Added reflection ID w/ base value of 15
+ Increased poison base value to 1800* instead of 800
+ Re-added strength requirement (don't bully me, I buffed poison!)
+ Added strength skill point bonus w/ base value of 3
+ Re-added Super Fast Attack Speed to be less comparable to Arc Rifle.
________________________________________

Considering I did my math correct (for thunder min/max, I used average of base value of thunder damage (12) and added the dexterity base value (15) to the overal dexterity that I will get which would be 125. 125 dex transfers into ~73.8% so we add that to (1+(Identification Boost)) and we got 1.858 for our ID boost. Bomb arrows will deal 558+232+139+1439 = 2368 min & 1069 + 445 + 267 + 3599 = 5380 max damage without any gear (you need 110 dex though lol). Also instead of 3.1 (which is very fast), you should put 4.3 for the change of attack speed (super fast) to get the correct values.

Please note that I did not calculate with the strength requirement and all you have to do is ADD 12.2% to your ID boost to get the correct values as I take 10 strength that is required and plus the base value (3) which ends up as 12.2%.

Balanced? Overtuned? Overpowered? Underpowered? Let me know.

 

i mean what do you say if it is then .-.

 

sry I meant to put "don't say overpowered or broken without a reason."

 

although i mean im no expert but looks k to me :/
i mean buff the dmg a bit, like compared to like weathered, it does roughly the same damage, if only a little bit more. considering its a bow, it should do a bit more damage, so maybe buff the thudner dmg? also considering the lore, maybe add some poison for the "electrified" effect? if so take some damage off tho depending on how much poison.

 

• Changed from Very Fast to Super Fast attack speed
• Added poison ranging from 200/3s to 867/3s
• Lowered base thunder damage by 40

Weathered has a very fast attack speed, so to change the damage a bit, I changed the attack speed from VF to SF to increase damage. Added poison for the "electrified" effect. Lowered base thunder damage to balance out the change in attack speed (though it's not much) and added poison.

 

Seems like an exact copy of Cataclysm but for Archers, but with a bit of poison.

 

Going off of you saying to give suggestions to make it not seem like pre-nerf cata: I don't think you can make it not seem like pre-nerf cata. Thunder items are all made to deal high damage, as seen by cata, fatal, and tcrack. A thunder bow wouldn't be any different, except it'd be even better then the other three because it's ranged.

The idea itself of a high level thunder mythic bow is going to be overpowered, and would dominate any other weapons because all the archer would have to do is shoot a single bomb arrow with decent aim and you're guarenteed to hit someone at least once, with massive damage on that single hit. On top of that, you could use arrow sheild and only have to walk into someone to blow them to smithereens. The only way to combat the power this item has would be to have the bow make the player freakishly vulnerable to attacks, like giving negative walkspeed as well as negative defenses and health. Any other ID's would have to give little benefit to the weapon at all, and if so would only be damage stats to highlight the fact that the bow turns you into a literal glass cannon.


TL;DR
The only way I could see this bow not being overpowered would be to make the user vulnerable to all attacks to compensate for the high damage (which would basically turn it into cata).

 

Noted, what do you think should be, well, changed to make it seem not like an exact copy? More debuffs? Lessen the damage by a lot (currently calculating damage on bomb arrow)? I'll try and think of something.

So basically you're saying, nerf damage because of archer's range and huge bomb arrow AoE, and add more debuffs to make it more high risk, high reward than just low risk, high reward (yeah, pretty dumb when I was thinking of it now that I didn't account for archer's range)?

 

All mythics have their own feel to it, and have a unique playstyle. Cataclysm is a thunder + air dagger with crazy thunder damage, for both spells and melee. To make this suggestion seem more like a mythic, you would probably have to completely remake it to make it more of a special item.

 

So I've kind of revamped the item a bit and I decided to revert the attack speed back to very fast, nerf the max thunder damage (was 400 lol), remove walk % & agility req, added strength req, removed spell & melee % damage, reduced thunder % damage, added negative mana regen, negative intel and defense skill point bonuses (less spam spells & less defense overall) to make it into a more balanced bow that doesn't do 25k bomb arrows w/ 200%+ thunder dmg, and not even on a critical hit. But now it's more of a high damage bow, but you can't spell spam with it (negative mana regen & negative intel skill point bonus) and you are a bit less tanky (negative defense skill point bonus) to counter the high damage. I think it restricts the SP a bit since you want to counteract the negative mana regen, but you need a lot of intelligence (or just use suppression idk) to get mana regen armor/accessories/bows and this also goes for defense, but you can prob just use agility. If you have any arguments to my newly added ID's, please say them. I'd love to have a endgame thunder bow that isn't too broken without balanced debuffs, but not as weak as Az or as strong as cataclysm (although I don't think the CT ever sees the mythic suggestions people made and considers to rework them).

 

Seems okay to me. There isn't a thunder-earth mythic, and this seems like it could be one with a few tweaks. Though right now it has a lot of negatives and not much good aspects to make up for it.

 

I could reduce or completely remove one, maybe two negative IDs to keep the item at good health (really high damage, but still has decent debuffs). All depends on what IDs I think should be tuned down a bit though. Thank you for your opinions on what I have made so far. I think I'll continue to tweak it a few more times.

 

I'm gonna take a crack at this one.

Spoiler: Incessant Echoes: No Changes

Incessant Echoes
2 slots
Very Fast Attack Speed

Neutral Damage: 115-220
Thunder Damage: 95-245

Class Req: Archer/Hunter
Level: 99
Strength Min: 15
Dexterity Min: 110

2% to 10% Thunder Damage
5 to 20 Dexterity
240/3s to 1040/3s Poison
-47% to -25% Earth Defense
-39% to -21% Earth Damage
-52% to -28% Water Damage
-2925 to -1575 Health
-3/4 to -1/4 Mana Regen
-13 to -7 Defense
-13 to -7 Intelligence

My first thought here is that there are way too many negative IDs, I would personally focus this down to only 2 or 3 negatives but make them fairly devastating rather than a huge spread like you have here. Right now it's kind of unclear what the bow is trying to keep you away from, especially with the small strength requirement and negative earth IDs. I'll also change the IDs from a range to an average as I go along.
I'm going to make this bow anti-mana, it will have extremely powerful spells due to the attack speed and base damage so let's make it's spammability the limiting factor here. This way, it's clear what the bow is going to struggle with and makes it more obvious to the player how the playstyle of this bow will work.

Spoiler: Incessant Echoes: Revamped Negatives

Incessant Echoes
2 slots
Very Fast Attack Speed

Neutral Damage: 115-220
Thunder Damage: 95-245

Class Req: Archer/Hunter
Level: 99
Strength Min: 15
Dexterity Min: 110

2% to 10% Thunder Damage
5 to 20 Dexterity
240/3s to 1040/3s Poison
Water Defense: -30
Mana Regen: -2
Intelligence: -10

(Removed Health, Earth Damage, Earth Defense, Water Damage. Added Water Defense.)

Now let's look at the positive IDs. It's clear from your lore that the poison is integral to how this weapon would hypothetically function, so I'm not going to remove that. It's a neat gimmick that isn't used too often, and though you don't generally see poison based thunder weapons, we'll embrace it. I'm just going to rebalance the numbers slightly, and add Reflection as a flavour ID so it has more positives than negatives. Having more green than red on an item's identifications is important, even if the IDs aren't super major, as it looks a lot more appealing to players. Reflection can work here, given the name, as you could be echoing attacks back at your opponent! I'll also remove the strength requirement while we're at it, it doesn't make much sense here.

Spoiler: Incessant Echoes: Revamped Positives

Incessant Echoes
2 slots
Very Fast Attack Speed

Neutral Damage: 115-220
Thunder Damage: 95-245

Class Req: Archer/Hunter
Level: 99
Dexterity Min: 110

Thunder Damage: 12
Dexterity: 8
Poison: 1111 (Yes, this is roughly what the poison should be at)
Reflection: 15
Water Defense: -30
Mana Regen: -2
Intelligence: -10

(Removed Strength Requirement. Added Reflection. Updated Dexterity, Thunder Damage, Poison.)

Now, let's just make sure the base damage is fitting. The amount of damage you have on this (337.5), considering the poison gimmick, is actually quite reasonable, so I'm only going to raise it a touch (350). 2 slots is fine, it has damage slightly under what it should due to the poison so giving it the option of a powder special is a nice compromise for the player. With that, I think I'm done!

Spoiler: Incessant Echoes: Final Product

Incessant Echoes
2 slots
Very Fast Attack Speed

Neutral Damage: 120-230
Thunder Damage: 100-250

Class Req: Archer/Hunter
Level: 99
Dexterity Min: 110

Thunder Damage: 12
Dexterity: 8
Poison: 1111
Reflection: 15
Water Defense: -30
Mana Regen: -2
Intelligence: -10

(Raised Base Damage)

Honestly, I might have made it a bit underpowered :3
(No, it's not going ingame, I just figured I'd give a bit of insight into how I make and balance items, and thought this would be a fun item to try)

If you're looking for an endgame thunder bow, at least Arc Rifle exists now, right?

 

wow xav work O.o i havent looked at it yet but it ll probably be fine... its 8am and i have yet to sleep something is wrong with me ;-; no but srsly cool thing balancing this without revealing our baselines ;o

 

LOL I hate reading all of this, but It's good information. Thank you for the suggestion and as said previously, there were too many negative IDs, so I'll cut down on them a bit. Also the way you described what was good or not good was excellent. Definitely love the type of writing you use to put things into context.

 

If you did want to bring it back to super fast attack speed, I would bring the base damage to a total of around 255, just so you know!

 

I changed a bit of the IDs and removed 3, including the strength requirement as you suggested. Although I kept some negative values because without one or the other, the bow could've been too strong. For example, if I removed the health bonus like you suggested, there wouldn't be any risk while wielding the weapon. Sure you have negative mana regen, but that can be fixed rather easily with suppression. Having the negative health bonus makes the bow more risky to use, but still is able to output tons of damage. I may change it back to super fast because of the massive changes to the base damage to make it not seem like lament vs nepta floodbringer damage wise because of the attack speed difference, but I think I have to calculate the damage on bomb arrow first before I change it again, lol!

 

Liking the changes but if poison is a main mechanic here, then it definitely needs to go up to at least 1000.

 

Changed base value of poison from 800 to 1800 (probably could've done 1500, but it's ok). Having a max value of 2340/3s poison with a very fast attack speed could be hard to proc without thorns or reflection so adding that tiny bit of reflection was a good choice.

 

wwoah okay mayb e n o that m uch i w asth ink ing l i ke 1200