Discussion in 'Wynncraft' started by Jackkoh, Sep 10, 2022.
As a writer this feels relatable
bump because more opinions = good
I think this update did an amazing job with spells and letting builds be more creative. Definitely makes the game less repetitive.
Balancing could be a little bit better but I assume it was extremely hard enough adding over 350 abilities. Also please revert the poison nerfs a little bit :(
My main problem is that there isn’t much new content for us max level players, however for what we got, TNA is great, and I hope CGG will be as well. Hopefully grinding forge will be more tempting if 8/8 chests gives more than a 1% mythic chance
8/10 Fruma now pls
“a spell change” funny way of saying we rewrote the entire combat system from the ground up and more or less added 10 classes
If it makes you feel any better, I can say with decent confidence that this update’s batch of quests took a few months less than 1.20’s batch did.
Doesn't fix any of the going issues with the game(play), only adds 1 mechanic on top of it. pokerface/10, but i respect the devs' effort
In terms of the class changes, I feel like assassin got the short-end of the stick. As a melee assassin main pre-2.0, there isn't an upgrade path that I feel really integrates well without relying on spells, which means investing in intel and water, which I don't want to do. Perhaps that is a little picky, but it really makes it difficult for assassins, so I think a little more tuning on that class would be beneficial.
2.0 has been good so far but it is by no means over. There’s tons of work that CT has done and still needs to do (that’s why it isn’t 1.21 lol) whether that be IMs needing to rebalance or redesign parts of the item pool, archetypes needing to be balanced by Salted or some quests/challenges/other content needing to be finished by GMs and builders
I want to be clear, CT have done a great job and I don’t want to shit on them at all, it’s just important to know that 2.0 is still being developed and people acting like it’s all concrete and final are missing the point. Assassin may be a bit too underpowered but that’s likely to change
Unfortunately, I think the lack of melee accessibility is true of every class except archer and maybe fallen warrior. 2.0 really didn’t do a good job of making melee gameplay much deeper, especially when compared to the complexity of the spell reworks we got.
I disagree actually. Of course, melee is far from perfect and I feel it deserves more specific abilities (like Twain's Arc), but I do think a lot of depth was added to melee this update (if anything it was made it way too strong with eh exception of Mage). Warrior and Archer are probably the best examples, as for Warrior, abilities such as the entire Corrupted mechanic and Paladin abilities are equally as applicable to melee as they are to spell. Archer has options of multi-shot in Boltslinger or focus and Twain's Arc in Sharpshooter. Shaman also feels a lot better mechanically with the choice between Distant Grasp/Hand of the Shaman and other modifiers like Ritualist masks and Acolyte's toolkit. Assassin heavy melee has become infinitely more interesting although I do agree that having to constantly build marks on enemies with tier-stack is really annoying. Mage got the short end of the stick, with absolutely nothing for melee in specific (although melee is utilized for both Riftwalker and Lightbender) asides from Pyrokinesis. Melee does need more mana now as most abilities/mechanics require some sort of spell usage, but I think overall this is fine since it adds more depth and typically it doesn't require really intensive spell usage other than occasionally casting War Scream or Uproot.
As for rating 2.0 as an update... to me it currently feels like a 6, although I suspect it will likely only get higher over time. This isn't me trying to antagonize either developers or CT, but the update feels somewhat unfinished. The ability tree has a lot of issues regarding design and balance that have gone unaddressed throughout the entire beta, and content wise there's a lot less than previous updates. There's only a handful of build reworks and new/reworked quests (that are entirely limited to Gavel, even the Gavel Reborn update had more non-gavel content), although they're all incredibly high quality and I can understand it taking more time to pump stuff out now. TNA is probably my favorite thing this entire update, as it absolutely nailed most of the criticisms I had with 1.20 raids. The new scripting system seems to allow for a lot more creative freedom, so it will be interesting to see what future updates look like. Overall, I think (hope) the ability tree is gonna get a lot better over time, and my own personal rating will increase with it. I also understand why staff may have wanted to get the update out whenever possible, as while it launched with some issues, this has been among the longest amount of time for a major update and players will obviously grow restless over time.
friendship ended with Assassin, Shaman is my new best friend
Teleport is now a valid choice of transport, which is nice, it's especially useful in places like the canyons where otherwise you'd either have to navigate a maze or climb each mountain individually with the pre-2.0 teleport
Hollow serenity is an amazing quest and I loved it
Aldorei's secret part 2 is complete garbage and makes no sense lore-wise (along with having a lot of grammar mistakes with the new dialog system they have for it)
I dunno I'd probably give it a 7/10
Actually, Assassin [Shadestepper] does not build marks with melee, it only builds marks with smoke bomb and spin attack--both spells. I think an easy-peasy fix to Shadestepper would be to add that upgrade in somewhere. Because of this, melee Assassin build will always be reliant on consistent spellcasting, which is too much to invest in for a good melee build. I think you confused Shadestepper with Mage's Riftwaker, which builds winded with melee attacks. Now that I think about it, Riftwalker should be the path to rely on spells to build winded stacks, as mage is inherently more spellbased than Assassin. Just switching the two could prevent redundancy and fix a few issues IMO.
I didn't forget.
You implied that Assassin builds marks by tierstacking, that is not true. The nature of Wynncraft's mana system in conjunction with the element system and how it interacts with the Assassin upgrade paths is inherently a disadvantage to melee builds as opposed to spell builds. Because of the change to the mana system, its very difficult to run a spell-focused build without significant investment into intelligence skill points (water).
Shadestepper relies on spells to build marks, to increase damage. A shadestepper's path is thunder and earth, which is not water, which means it's ideal to do incorporate intelligence points into your build, along with strength and/or dexterity. (The other paths are totally spell reliant as well) So, if you wanted to do a 2.0 melee build on assassin, its ideal to incorporate water/intelligence into your build to more effectively spam spells and build marks to melee enemies and build damage. You could argue this adds depth, but frankly this makes assassin more stale since every single type of build has to rely on intelligence and mana. Pre-2.0, you could build a melee assassin build without worrying about mana/intelligence, and you could perform quite well. With the mana changes in 2.0, at 0 intelligence, you have 100 mana, and you can cast about two spells--a smoke bomb and a spin attack--gain a few marks, and wait 10 seconds until your next spell to build marks from. If you change your build to incorporate water, then you are sacrificing SP's that could go to damage or defense instead, which is stale.
By contrast, Riftwalker mage can easily incorporate water as its main source of damage is spellcasting anyways. Even though riftwalker relies on melee hits to build damage, those melee hits don't require any SP investment whatsoever; the only factor is attack speed. (Which slow or higher has the same effect)
I think Riftwalker's melee stacking and Shadestepper's spellbased mark stacking should be swapped, to improve depth of both paths and to revert the effective nerf of assassin melee post 2.0, as well as not having every Assassin pathway rely on intelligence/water.
P.S. - I am aware that Riftwalker allows ice snake to stack winded, but the point is that riftwalker's main attack adds stacks and shadestepper's doesn't.
No, I did not. Not once did I ever say assassin built marks by meleeing. I meant that having to constantly build marks on enemies with tier-stack due to needing to smoke bomb multiple enemies to build marks which are effectively infinite (I know they have a duration, but in practice with constant smoke bomb application it is infinite) would be annoying. In regards to constant waves of enemies, you'd need a lot more mana sustain to cast smoke bombs to work for your marked DPS increase, however saying that melee assassin in 2.0 is FORCED to invest into intelligence is an overexaggeration. Besides, it's also arguable that this is how it should be. I know assassin mains must be quite frustrated seeing how other classes outmatch it currently, but the strength of other classes is overall just really overtuned for the most part and assassin is perhaps the most "balanced" of them all. I think it's also important bring up that assassin melee in even 1.20 was way too overtuned, as while its spells were balanced in a manner with low spell multipliers to compensate for the vanish DPS increase and made it competitive with the likes of archer, melee builds effectively received that dps increase for free, and in 2.0 it's actually finally gotten to a more fair state. I know comparing assassin melee to the likes of archer, warrior, and shaman in 2.0 makes it look weak, but again, I feel it's as if these classes are far stronger than they should be and will be receiving nerfs.
Every class in the game except assassin is overtuned? As in, most content is overly trivial for everyone except assassins and they should all be nerfed? Want to make sure that's the point you're making here.
I do. Of course, not everything I consider to be overtuned, but a good chunk of archetypes are pretty busted and or make other archetypes stronger than they should be. There are quite a few archetypes that feel really good damage wise though. Battle Monk is pretty perfect, Paladin damage wise, Arcane Mage but honestly it could use a buff, Riftwalker and Lightbender now after the winded changes also feel good, Summoner is honestly pretty fine now but could use slight nerfs and transfer some effigy damage to puppets, Ritualist by itself is fine, but when Acolyte and Ritualist join forces you get both absurdly high sustain and damaging auras. As I've said, I don't have too much experience with 2.0 assassin and it probably could use some buffs especially when compared to 1.20 assassin, but when the average DPS of builds in 2.0 is measured in the hundreds of thousands to millions, it's not hard to see why assassin may feel weak in comparison.
Archetypes are cool, but Im leveling up a warrior and Im currently in the nineties and after the update every other quest seems to have a bug that doesnt allow me to finish it soooo