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Patch 1.20.4 Full Changelog

Discussion in 'News & Patches' started by Salted, Sep 18, 2021.

  1. Bongo_Fin

    Bongo_Fin Professional Burden VIP

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    stacking potions hmm...
    no longer have to visit bank everytime I finish a raid bc my inventory is full of potions hell yeah

    also sorcery no longer yeeting me around sounds cool
     
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  2. Dr Zed

    Dr Zed Famous Adventurer HERO

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    By that logic then we can’t ever nerf any item or consumable less it impedes low skilled players. There’s a fine line between being accessible and just being broken and unbalanced. You really don’t need sp pots to play the main content; and if you struggle with a part like say Qira, you can just use discord or the in game chat to meet up with others. That’s how I got through Qira and it is a MMO after all.
    ________________________________
    It being possible is an issue for the same reason a level 20 player shouldn’t beat the final boss by themselves. It was absolutely never intended to be beaten with level 20 gear and it just shows that you could be as powerful as a person with endgame gear. Yes, most people couldn’t have done the challenge, but that doesn’t mean it should be possible though regardless if it affects the economy. You said yourself the potions are OP and YY notably doesn’t use pots for most of his LI challenge runs. I’ve seen way less powerful builds and items get trashed on and nerfed for being too OP, so stat pots should be no exception.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2021
  3. JaydonTheWarrior

    JaydonTheWarrior Shaggy. HERO

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    Then bring another player.
    You may not want to hear this, but Wynncraft is an MMO.
    I understand there are a lot of players who don't want to socialize, but even with that argument, there are still plenty of ways to make the game easier for one's self.
    Playing full tank, taking more HP potions, using crafted consumables, mana potions are viable now, fuck you could even play mage, and the skill point potions themselves still exist and are still really good, just not insanely broken anymore.

    All of these options still exist, they weren't removed.
     
  4. Stormarend

    Stormarend The classes DO NOT correspond with the elements.

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    On the subject of difficulty, but in response to no post in particular, I think it's worth noting that you're not born good or bad at Wynncraft. Getting good at Wynncraft depends on how long you've played the game, but more importantly how you've played the game.

    If the game teaches players that they can get an easy free win by using skill potions, then of course they're going to have trouble with the most challenging content without them. The fact that most of the game is incredibly easy with the exception of some ridiculous difficulty spikes doesn't help that problem. I don't believe in skilled or unskilled players. Not in the context of Wynncraft, anyway. It's just that Wynncraft doesn't have any mechanisms that allow you to actually build up skill, save for the few people that are just really talented and those with an ungodly amount of time on their hands.

    If Wynncraft did a better job balancing difficulty so the player actually gets better, then we wouldn't """need""" compensatory mechanics like the skill potions. Their efficacy is in large part justified by a problem they help create. I definitely agree with the decision to nerf them.
     
  5. Druser

    Druser ele defs don't matter HERO Featured Wynncraftian

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    Thing is, there are plenty of casual players who are then unable to experience the main game content without grinding out their skills for long periods of time. It takes far more time to get good enough to make it through an endgame challenge like LI or EO unassisted than it does to play all the quests first time around (note that EO even locks a quest behind it!). I know it from personal experience - I attempted LI dozens of times when I reached endgame for the first time before I was able to beat it without skill pots. It took me about 3 months to reach endgame the first time and something similar to beat LI for the first time after reaching endgame.

    Also, Wynncraft actually does do a really good job balancing difficulty to make players improve - you can observe this on plenty of streams and videos of newcomers playing the game for the first time (I recommend skunkmunkee's streams on youtube as an excellent example). Thing is, veterans can solo steamroll combat challenges far beyond what is remotely doable even by teams of reasonably competent casuals. I personally watched live as skunkmunkee teamed up to fight the Eye and repeatedly lost before eventually stopping his streams.
     
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  6. starx280

    starx280 The boy who cried lunar

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    I don’t want the game to be too easy, but I don’t want this friendly-fun mmo turning into dark souls either, and considering the current difficulty of some of the “big” lategame content, it’s getting there.

    So I’m splitting down the middle. I’d say that this pot nerf is okay as long as some of the lategame gets tweaked a bit in the future.
     
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  7. JaydonTheWarrior

    JaydonTheWarrior Shaggy. HERO

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    I think Wynn should streamline its party system more, and further encouraged teaming up with other players so that grouping up with others is often the main form of modulating difficulty.
    That being said, I think crafted consumables more than makeup for what skill point potions used to be, while also encouraging player interaction.
    I think that's being largely ignored here, that crafted items have since been added to the game, basically taking over for skill point potions.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2021
  8. RussetMantle

    RussetMantle Skilled Adventurer CHAMPION

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    Not everyone has the time and effort to grind professions for crafting.
     
  9. strikeflame5356

    strikeflame5356 All hail our lord Cthulu

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    Thank god finally an hpr nerf (I'm gonna die for saying that)

    You're gonna have to buff those items in other ways tho, ignis especially.

    Maybe increase ignis's friend healing so that it's still a good support, but the wielder themself has to try to stay alive by avoiding attacks, also buffing ignis's damage so that it's still viable as a solo weapon (a little bit like what happened to Resu)
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2021
    starx280 and Leafish like this.
  10. ChromaticDragons

    ChromaticDragons Just some nerd CHAMPION

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    Will my OKR now have stealing?
     
  11. Stormarend

    Stormarend The classes DO NOT correspond with the elements.

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    Doesn't this prove my point? If it takes you the same time to do one piece of content that it does to complete the game, then either that piece of content is too hard or you're not good for it to be a reasonable challenge. I have a hard time believing the former, since clearly there are ways to consistently beat LI which do not require you to have thousands of hours in the game. As for the latter, why do you think it might be that LI is unreasonably difficult for a player with an entire playthrough worth of experience? And how come LI is a pushover to some others? It's not because some players just are bad. It's because, at the risk of exaggerating, the only way the game prepares you for LI, is LI. And then it's no wonder that it seems like the only way to get good is to bash your head against a wall for hours on end.

    Likewise, if a player has to team up to fight The Eye and still can't beat it to the point of rage quitting then you can't tell me that the game has adequately helped them improve. EO's difficulty is the exact same story. There's an easy flowchart with which you can beat it pretty much 100% of the time, so you can't really call it "too difficult", but there's no way a player is going to figure it out on their own within a reasonable amount of time. This just means that the game apparently hasn't taught them how to tackle difficult challenges, which might have to do with the fact that 90% of the game is several orders of magnitude easier than EO is.

    There's no way you can say the game isn't poorly balanced to make players improve and at the same time say that you can't expect players to be able to handle endgame content without an aid as ridiculously powerful as skill potions. Skill potions really only fix this problem at a surface level, but they ignore the fact that the reason they exist in the first place is because of shit balancing, a problem they don't solve.
     
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  12. Dr Zed

    Dr Zed Famous Adventurer HERO

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    You can just buy consumables
     
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  13. ghoti0315

    ghoti0315 Josuke Higashikata (def not the part 8 one) CHAMPION

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    noooooooooooooooooooooo
    ________________________________
    no, it is super fast attack speed actually and there is one more "0" in -4 ice snake spell cost
     
  14. TwageTomato

    TwageTomato Coder | Like-Giver | Tomato | Musician CHAMPION

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    I feel like it may still be useful as a self-inflicted challenge for the masochists in the community to use in various boss fights for bragging rights (see: beating Qira with depressing weapons)
     
  15. Druser

    Druser ele defs don't matter HERO Featured Wynncraftian

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    That's kind of the point, that some people make them and other people buy them.

    (setting aside that numerous parts of the game force everyone to do professions for no reason...)
     
  16. ghoti0315

    ghoti0315 Josuke Higashikata (def not the part 8 one) CHAMPION

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    Actually it depends on class builds and, well, your skill. I don't have anything to add on the "your skill" part because I believe that I am not in a right place to talk about skill.

    The real difference is your build and how you play the game. Imagine you are with an ETW grandmother build, with 100k+ dps (uhh I have no idea) with rage. Of course you could destroy the eye in like under 2 minutes, but that is if you could reach yygamer's skill level. Or maybe you could go a 10k dps exploited build, with 14k+ health, greed and decent amount of defence/agility points. With def/agi points being mentioned, this becomes a different story: They are stats. And it actually means if you drink a lvl 95 sp pot, your def/agi in an etw build could possibly reach efa level (given that no items gives high amount of sp). And that is not really okay for me.

    I felt that pain as well - I spent 5+ LE for LI for literally nothing on its release. And at that point I ranted at cybel and idol in the forums. I didn't really want to beat LI with skill potions because it would make it too easy. I searched for a lot of class builds and stuff... And it turned out that old cancer apoc/ignition allows you to play it braindead. Or if it is right now... I use exploited assassin with revenant.

    Sometimes with a "bad" build you need to have more skills to make up for it. If nerfing stat potions could really make players struggle on contents, then the first thing I would say now is to get a better build with better sustain. And if people continue playing, I believe they could get good over time as well.
     
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  17. Druser

    Druser ele defs don't matter HERO Featured Wynncraftian

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    While true, I think it depends on the circumstances. The people in question had perfectly good builds (I designed one of them personally).
     
  18. LostWolfCanine

    LostWolfCanine Skilled Adventurer CHAMPION

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    Is there a possibility for a fix for some crafting items just randomly not stacking? I can post a video of the issue if you'd like cause I'm certain half of my bank space is just crafting items that I can combine into stacks
     
  19. musicalluci

    musicalluci Well-Known Adventurer VIP

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    With potions autostacking how will that work with different levels of potions, like a lvl 60 vs 65, are they just different stacks?
     
  20. Leafish

    Leafish Travelled Adventurer

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    it's still one potion. Im pretty sure it just drinks the highest level potion