Post 1.20.4 thoughts on Wynncraft

Nearly always its an invisible armorstsnd or slime. Which works fine for stationery NPC's or areas. But issue is some areas you have free flight meaning an invisible armour stand is gonna be difficult since where do you put it?
Right clicking blocks i believe (like notg) is possibly due to the block being specific. Idk how that mechanic works tho

 

I cant be assed to read through all 8 pages of this (good job for the killer thread Travis) so someone else has probably said this:

But all of this is a written out testament to why so many players who used to spend excessive time on Wynn are incredibly burnt out and irritated with the game. I started playing 4 years ago & have well over a thousand wars in 1.20 but I'm bored, I have nothing to do. The main thing i enjoy doing on Wynn is warring but its pointless, I can't impact anything significantly and it does nothing but burn me out, as it stands I've spent more time enjoying my homework in the past month then i have Wynn. Its a feeling many people right now are experiencing, whether or not their guilds are on map or not; there's nothing to do.

Its not the CT's fault, I know that, so the blame goes fully on Salted for this. Listening to the community is critical, I mean, look at Genshin's reviews after this anniversary. It literally doesn't matter how popular a game is, you need to listen to your players. But thats what you're NOT doing??

Do you think you know better than all of us or something? I'm sorry but its just downright arrogant to assume you know exactly whats best for the game and to ignore everyone fucking else because they don't know as much as you do. Wynn's done amazing things but some of these systems are downright awful, sure the shifting looks nice but its AWFUL to play. SR is a cool system but oh my fucking god its horrifically broken, its even worse that the rewards further demotivate people who aren't on map.

Can administration get their heads out of their asses for once because 1. Zeer needs a payrise and 2. Salted needs to listen to people and actually let his devs fix this game so that it doesn't die.

 

If the fact that most people are choosing to use morph instead of engaging with the build system and people are choosing to not get involved with the profession system because the outcomes aren't worth the effort is a good sign that the balance in this game isn't there...

 

It's a fear of change which is kind of insane considering how much and how wildly the game used to change before the clean, sanitized version of Wynn started where nobody working on the game can talk about it and criticism is never addressed. Just look at this thread, I pointed out that the balance is shit, got a lovely reply from the item team saying they have no idea why I would feel that way, I replied explaining in great detail why I think they're doing a bad job and boom, radio silence. I'm not entitled to a response, but it's not a good look to go radio silent after you say;

"if you genuinely feel like nothing has changed in regards to items and that's our fault, please elaborate"

I get it, you don't actually want feedback unless it agrees with you Bart, but instead of trying to sugar coat the fact that you don't want to entertain discussion that goes against the core premise that you're doing a good job, just come out and say you don't give a shit about fundamental issues with the balance of the game because you don't want to do anything beyond shuffling a couple numbers around.

 

I agree with @ron111701 on this one; it’s not necessarily durability that turns people off. It’s the extreme time commitment and tediousness of professions that does it. And it’s not necessarily that all crafted items are terrible, at least when it comes to consumables; it’s just the same reason that people can’t or won’t spend time grinding professions or buying them from others.

Imo, removing durability would just do more harm than good by upsetting the power balance and not attract any new people to professions.

 

It's fine if you disagree on the solution to the issue, but nothing you said really refutes my argument that the lack of engagement in the build system for the average player and the lack of interest in professions is a good sign the item team is doing a bad job.

Also, before the original massive crafted item nerf which happened like a month after 1.18 crafted items were in a much better place despite having durability, removing it clearly isn't the only solution, but it's the only solution which doesn't require buffing the items by a massive amount.

 

writing this on the train on my way home after i spent the last 9 hours on uni (evening lab courses blow holy shit), i'll try to write a proper full response later tonight as it seems you've been very patiently waiting but please note that i wasn't speaking on behalf of the item team, i figured i didn't need to specify ot for a second time considering my previous post just before, but still talking purely as a player here. please also treat me like a fellow player, i'd loke to think that adds a little more to the conversation than assuming i'm immediately against anything you say because i'm also an item maker

 

Well I can’t speak too much on the build system as a whole, but for professions it just goes back to what I said earlier about there’s no way to please everyone and any further changes without addressing that core issue will continue in result in unbalanced and half baked outcomes. You simply can’t make professions both time consuming and tedious yet accessible and easy at the same time. It’s why some players love that professions are easier and why others hate that professions are easier.

 

yes today I will beat up qira with third eye, bob's mythic wand (predpos???), crystal, soul signal, memento because the builds haven't changed since gavel released!

I can't tell if you're being serious, joking, or genuinely oblivious. So much has changed since gavel release that the build scene then is largely unrecognizable now. 0-int spellspam was unimaginable then, hell even normal spellspam was hard to achieve with the best cycling costs for any class essentially locked at 2/2 (poor, poor warrior...)

Have you heard of meta items? I heard they're pretty nice and see use in many builds. Maybe you should check them out -- might be useful

Jokes aside I'm pretty sure this isn't true. There are some more "niche" items intentionally -- weapons/armor that end up forming a "centerpiece" for builds but even those can have quite a bit of variation. Some items are overshadowed by others but that is somewhat unavoidable when you are dealing with so many items across a wide level range.

play heavy spell

There's quite the difference just between elemental tri(quad?) identities, although that is being eroded slightly by str/dex changes -- TWF/ETWF for raw power, EWA/ETWA trades some raw power for speed, ETF can go tanky or heavy melee offense, or even spell damage (ultra mobility!), ETFA can go melee, spellspam, or fking heavy spell, EWF fills a similar role as TWF/ETWF but with more inherent hpr and less walk, ETA can go melee or spellspam as raw power with walkspeed, and of course ETW (haha)

(we don't talk about TWA here)

and that's just a broad overview, there is much more fine grained detail here hmmm.

For what its worth "viable" is a very loose term that depends on the player a lot. Fundamentally most of wynn content leans toward the "easy" end -- with a proper build you can cheese almost everything. A lot of the fun in "post-endgame"(?) play for me personally at least is trying funny stuff with the tremendous flexibility of the item system -- not to mention the fact that there exist people who will build but rarely play the game, just because building itself can be fun lol

Though you are kinda right, lots of new players just ask for "best build X Y Z", this is another place where a better intro to the build system and build archetypes could really help

idk I use crafted items (not flapis if you were wondering)

crafted weapons and accessories are kinda nuts lol

crafted armor can be cracked, durability/hitting feels more of a problem with the implementation of durability and not the fundamental concept of durability.

myes I too hate grinding 124159x lv100 professions for every class, I hate the item team for making the game so boring

Jokes aside it would be nicer if there was a way ingame to "onboard" new players to the build system -- right now all the tools are third party, heck the damage compass is just straight wrong. Some sort of manual or tutorial/official mechanics guide would be cool

Morph is comfy, no doubt. its almost never* optimal though
if professions (in their current state) were more mandatory people would riot lol (just look at the quests requiring profs)
and this is all the IM's fault 100%

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nice

 

You said a whole lot here and still, somehow missed the entire point. I have personal issues with the item system and how professions are handled, but all my disappointment is just a front for the core issue of the item balance being bad. It's funny that you brought up such a comical build considering post gavel builds didn't use bobs wand, that's pre-gavel and was never near level 100, third eye is really good and people still use it and you later brought up morph, which is one of the most dominant sets and has been around for an actual eternity. It's also funny to me that you would skip out on a proper weapon pick, it's as if almost every meta weapon is a mythic which were introduced during the Gavel update... Of all the straw men you could have built, that one wasn't a great choice. As for armor, if morph is the most popular build and it's been around since Gavel (or soon after), I would say that's a point towards the meta not changing in years since it at the very least hasn't changed enough to make Morph not worth using. If you want to call morph the popular build because it's easy, that's true but it also means you buy into my premise that the item system is needlessly hard because you wouldn't need an easy option if it wasn't.

Beyond that, your disagreement with my opinions on how to fix these issues is perfectly fine, I'm not here trying to sell the solution, I'm trying to point out that there's a problem in the first place and it's not productive to do so without at least trying to come up with solutions.

As for people rioting about professions if they were mandatory, I genuinely don't understand how you can say that without immediately realizing that this game has a serious issue when a massive amount of the progression in this game leads absolutely nowhere. The idea that professions are in a broken state is something I agree with, I don't see how saying that back to me constitutes as an argument against what I've said, it's more confusing then anything.

And finally, as for me yelling at the IM, I just think it's funny that he was happy to respond and try to call out my arguments when they were vague and hyperbole, even going as far as to say he was open to hearing criticism, yet the second I made a serious critique all he dropped off the face of the Earth. My issues aren't with the item team, they're with the person who is happy to talk shit when it's easy but isn't willing to stand up to actual critiques of their work and comments. I have no beef with the devs or IM's, I owe them nothing and they owe me nothing but if Bart or anyone else working on the game wants to growl and show their fangs they should be ready to bite.

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Oh, trust me, I don't think you're representing the item team, I think I was fairly clear when in my call out I specifically named you. You don't represent the whole, you might be an important cog in the machine but at the end of the day you're still just a cog, I get you don't have the ability to independently fix all the issues I outlined.

I don't think you're against anything I say because you're an item maker, I think you would be against what I'm saying because my core premise is that your team is doing a bad job and it's in your best interest to defend yourself, there's no hard personal feelings here, I too am a student and have been on calls all day interviewing for Coop positions and group projects and so I can understand that it's not easy to work on the game, this isn't your job. I'm not asking for you to agree with me, I'm asking for somebody who works on this game, for once in the history of these forums and this game, to admit there are issues of some kind, literally any kind, with the game and to admit that there's either no interest in solving them or that they're working to solve them through means beyond minor adjustments here and there. This is the first time I've been active on the forums for something like 8 months now, I'm mainly only here to check up on the guild spreadsheet, but the reason why I gave up on playing isn't because I don't love this game, it's because the lack of disclosure and the lack of even the most basic communication killed any interest I had in this game.

While I'm on that topic actually, I think there should be a vote to rename the "News" section to the "Sales and Patches" section because there's nothing there but that. Is it really, truly that hard to make a short post every month or two about what direction the people who are working on the game want to take it so there can at least be some assurance that the people working on this have some intention of actually trying to improve the product they're making?

 

I honestly had spent some time determining whether I should even comment on the thread (excluding the fact I literally don't comment on forums at all making this the first comment I make), and I can't avoid commenting on this.

Read through most of the thread and one thing that did become most noticeable, is there has been very few comments from any staff members. I have also seen no comments from the community manager (not sure what's going on there) which is a clear failure of Wynncraft's team as a whole since this thread has been around for multiple days. And not even just no comments from them here, I have seen nothing from them in weeks. I could just be reading the wrong threads or be in the wrong place, but something tells me that's not true either. If the community manager isn't managing and relaying the community's complaints, their role is of no value. After 8 pages of this thread, to hear nothing from an admin such as Salted, a moderator, or the community manager, is downright insulting.

I'll go through some of the issues you mentioned in the thread here too and add some possible suggestions so I can't be accused of complaining about a problem and offering no solutions. Note that I wrote a ton so if you don't want to read everything, don't. Read what applies to you if you don't want to read everything. If you see any issues, feel free to mention it to me and I'll modify accordingly.

Spoiler: Quests

I feel the problem isn't the shifting as has been said before. The problem is the slowness, you can't skip dialogue automatically for future re-runs, and the quest book seems pointless at displaying anything. I actually played right after it came out as an update to play the new quests from the update using a new character. In one of those quests, I almost got killed because I couldn't do anything mid-dialogue. What do you think a new player is going to think of them dying mid-dialogue without being able to do anything? They've made it clear they won't revert it but here's some suggestions to make it better:

-Add invulnerability while in dialogue.

-Add an option to toggle the slowness effect. Sorry, but the "zoom" isn't all that cool to me and is downright annoying but to others it may still be worth holding onto.

-Add an option after hitting level 100 to toggle all quest dialogue to off. This would mean whenever you interact with an NPC, the quest book would immediately update to the next section of the quest and would have the dialogue show up in the quest book. Prevents new players from skipping dialogue and allows veterans to do it freely without losing anything critical.

The one thing to note about those suggestions, is none of them change anything about the system as is. They simply are additions to the system. If these can't be done or anything similar can't be, please just kill the dialogue system entirely. To complain that they don't want to put in the time is inexcusable as this is a major issue which is acting like a repellant for players.

Spoiler: Guilds

I don't really get to comment much here as my "guild" was an HC Guild before the Challenge Modes were added and it died right as they were. I also don't understand much, if anything, about wars so I can't comment on them. But the thing I can comment on, is the poor design of guilds in general. I am not a person who does or likes warring. Personally, I just prefer most of the other stuff from guilds like the socialization aspect and I don’t like the idea of a guild’s only purpose being warring.

What I'd honestly recommend to fix this issue, which may be hard to do but depends, is have specific types of guilds which focus on different things. Not everyone wants to just war. Some people prefer lootrunning, some prefer professions, some even prefer the challenge modes. So, make guilds able to be categorized on creation based on these and give incentive to join these types of guilds that support the playstyle you want to do. Having types such as warring, lootrunning, professions, dungeons/raids, challenge modes like HIC(H), or even just socialization guilds would be a big add. If that’s not enough to incentivize, it’s possible to add like some guild-specific stuff for those who enjoy those types of things such as like a special dungeon/raid accessible for dungeons guilds, unique territories with special perks for warring, a special lootrunning area you can do with a group at high guild level (no Mythics, they’re unbalanced enough already, we don’t need more problems), or even just like badges that acknowledge achievements of these guilds.

Then go one step further. Add like a Guild Board to Detlas and other large cities where players can see all of these and try and ask for invitations instead of just random advertisements in chat.

Spoiler: Professions

It's been mentioned a ton and the fact nothing's been done is pretty sad. Professions are mostly just annoying for little add. Adding quests exclusively built for Professions that give exp would be so nice and could be a cool way of making them more fun. You could use these quests to not only give experience towards the gatherings and professions involved, but also have ways of teaching players how to craft better.

Regarding the whole, "Our efforts are lost by new updates" problem, a simple solution would be to give these players like a badge or something for their efforts, as has been stated already, save the leaderboard somewhere, and reset it every time changes are made to professions. Now their efforts aren't lost, but acknowledged, and new players wanting to leaderboard climb won't feel discouraged by gigantic numbers.

Spoiler: Raids

What you mentioned was probably at best about 5-10% of the issues. Raids shouldn’t be where you get carried by high levels through the raid. It should be doable at level with a group. To not be doable at level means the content was made incorrectly. This needs to be looked at on top of the bugs by possibly determining which enemies may be a little too strong for on-level players. Don’t complain it’s too easy if you’re above the recommended level of a raid, it’s annoying to on-level players and discouraging. Another issue is the T3 Mats that are given. This is just a no unless it’s rare as this kills all the work done by Professions. If anything, it should be a rare chance of that and instead be T1/T2 Mats. If it’s still not enough, then the chance for T3 can be removed entirely. I feel having some other things to do in Professions would be nice so it’s not just the usual clicking of nodes constantly and this isn’t a terrible alternative. However, it shouldn’t be better than grinding directly. There’s more I didn’t mention that are issues, but these alone should be making it clear there’s a lot to fix.

Spoiler: Challenge Modes

Before we add anything new, a massive overhaul needs to be done to Hunted Mode. It really looks horrible now and pretty pointless. I get the point is combat, but it failed miserably as the balance isn’t present. A player shouldn’t just be walking up and one-shotting a person on level with them.

I’d say a possible new challenge mode could be one which involves leaderboards. It’d have its own leaderboards people could work on and have where they last 4-6 months before resetting forcing players would need to reset to new classes. Sure, it doesn’t sound unique, but it’d at least be beneficial to players who do enjoy that sort of thing and wouldn’t be out of reach for new players who are interested.

Spoiler: Lootrunning

Everything that could be said about this has likely already been said, but obviously, right now, it doesn’t work. It’s too easy to do with no drawbacks and also is too hard to do at times as well. Client-side chests are a start but would fall under the too easy category so, as I saw in a suggestion in the suggestions thread (credit goes to them for this, not me and I’m also certain it’s been mentioned in this thread too), have where chests start at 0 loot for a player when they join a world. It’d nerf the lootrunning massively and force players to actually play for a while before trying to loot chests. It would also boost the lootrunning amount they could do in a world by just waiting for chests to refill in between lootruns by playing. If there’s a problem with people just afking worlds to wait for a lootrun, they could simply just have where if a player has remained in the same location near loot chests for more than 15 minutes, loot stops accumulating for the chests for that person, preventing chest camping.

Spoiler: Mob Grinding

I do agree with the point about the totems for standard players. Why this is not a thing already, is beyond me. Could be just simply where those without ranks start with one per day and everyone can earn another for simply doing a daily reward for the day or a guild weekly reward. The whole nerfing totems into the ground because of a small group players shows foolishness at its finest. Instead of fixing the issue which is Mythics being easily grindable because Mob Totem enemies drop items, they just made them pointless. Worst part about it? Given it’s currently a rank perk, they pretty much just told people they’re willing to kill off those rank perks, but not some of the issues with Champion showing favoritism to the biggest spenders even though fixing Champion isn’t hard at all, and it wouldn’t involve taking away any perks (more on that later). Right now, Mob Totems should be unable to drop anything but ingredients or have where they can never give a Fabled/Mythic. It should be luck based for those as clearly intended, not “who can spend the most money”.

Spoiler: Economy

I don’t know whether I count as one of the “richer” players given I have about 5-6 stacks, but I will say that Emerald Pouches were probably a really bad addition as they are currently. They make it easier to hold emeralds on you while giving the ability to hold up to a stack of LE at max as well as converting to LE automatically. That’s just a no. You should have to return to town for turning things into LE. That should’ve never changed. I can understand emerald blocks, but not LE. If that change I suggest is added, the max emeralds that should be able to held at T7, should be up to 9 LE worth, a sensible amount.

From this point on are issues you didn’t address in the thread regarding the state of Wynncraft that I do feel need to also be addressed:

Spoiler: Champion

There’s a lot of issues here that have still not been addressed. I get it’s a touchy subject given how much people have donated toward the server and it is quite commendable, however, issues are issues.

When I first heard about Champion and saw the stuff it had, the main thing that concerned me, were Pet Tasks. They seemed OP before we found out what they actually did. The idea of being able to send your tool back to be repaired and get it back after a short period of time would be incredibly OP for Professions. Even the idea of selling items or putting stuff in your bank could be cause for concern. However, that was short-lived as all of it sucks and/or is broken. Fixing the bug and maybe buffing it a bit is a nice start, but if it is changed, please change how these work. Have where everyone can have pet tasks but have like a shorter cooldown for Champions to make it more worth but keep things balanced.

Another large issue that everybody wants addressed is Bomb Bell, but I’m not touching that. That’s too finicky and is the reason Champion is borderline P2W in the first place as well as why many bought the rank. Modifying it could possibly mean all who spent on Champion, wasted their money.

Champion Slots, I’m not sure where they stand, but if they haven’t been fixed to have where Champions don’t take up these slots first, this need to be fixed. This is not purposeful design, this is a bug. If anyone tries to argue otherwise, please understand you have absolutely no clue what you’re talking about as you are literally breaking the server through that. It is possible (if the issue is still around), to lock players who are not Champion out of worlds through this. That is the equivalence of a donator-only world. Again, if it still hasn’t been fixed since I haven’t checked if it has, a simple solution is to have where, whenever a Champion connects, they first take up Champion Slots, then additional Champions take up normal slots. If a Champion leaves and the world and slots are full, the main world slots are first to clear up, not the champion slots.

Spoiler: Items

This is a big section and bear with me on this one as it’s likely the longest section because it is the biggest failure.

Let’s start with the update that just came out. What in the actual hell is wrong with the Item Team? I know it sounds mean, but Mythics and Fableds are not priority and should never be the priority to add. Literally the only items added this update were Mythics and Fabled which are not accessible by most players, which is at least 85-90% of players given Fableds are easier to get but still a bit hard for average players. Worst part is the Mythics are only available in the already most overused place in the game for lootrunning, which is one of the only two ways to get them besides Forgery which is already not very doable cost-wise. What needs to be done if those won’t be fixed, is at least add another area to get these besides just Lutho. Please think about players before you just add things, Item Team, as these Mythics should’ve been delayed to a Major Update. In fact, new Mythics should never be outside of Major Updates at all since it gives new areas to find them anyways as well as lore to associate with them.

Another major issue, is the one brought up not long ago in the thread, about how Morph Set is the build used by most new players for end-game. This cannot be blamed on these players, nor other more experienced players. This is entirely on both the Item Team and Salted. I used to play Magic the Gathering a long while back (card game in case you’re interested), and it had the idea of standard decks, where a player would be focused on using one element type in their deck. These decks helped to introduce new players to what each element is focused on. As players improved, there were some more advanced decks that use 2-3 elements that showed how blending these types can give unique ideas. After a player has learned all of this, they can either stick with those decks, or make their own based on ideas they come up with. If it had followed the Wynncraft mentality, you’d have one weird rainbow deck with no clear concept besides just Rainbow and would tell you make your own deck if you want something different giving you no idea where to start.

I would say as a suggestion, delay whatever you originally were planning for items for your next major update since I have little doubt it is likely not going to help new players through the game or be of much value to the majority of people already playing constantly, and instead make more sets and change existing ones. I feel like sets as a whole were a very cool and needed idea. They give a sort of “build” of their own and introduce players to what can work together well for a build. However, they were pretty much negated and ignored because clearly the team has no idea what to do with them or is not able to understand what they are. A lot of sets are just useless or too rare to matter. A set I really liked the idea of were the Element Relic Sets early game. They had a lot of potential to teach what each element is about but they’re too rare and/or useless compared to newer content. Those need massive revamps and should be the new reward for Elemental Exercise where you choose a set instead and it makes it more about those sets and functions of those elements. It would both make Elemental Exercise better at its supposed job, but also make the sets viable.

There’s an even bigger issue than just the previous ones I mentioned that isn’t being talked about. I am willing to bet almost every single person here who has every made their own build, had absolutely no clue what most of the IDs and stats on stuff did at one point. Some are pretty straight forward, others, not so much. What I recommend is this, make a system where every time a player identifies an item that has IDs they’ve never seen before, it puts a message in chat regarding what the ID is, what it does, and the stat it’s most associated with for items. I would also suggest where it adds this to a specific section of your quest book where it adds all the IDs info you’ve accumulated so players who don’t remember what IDs do, can simply just go back to the book, and check whatever info they need on it. It would answer most questions being asked about items and what they do.

Another addition related to the above, would be a section of the tutorial that explains how about weapons affect spell and melee damage so it’s not really an unknown thing. Doesn’t have to be complicated, could be something like a simple dialogue line from the guard after making the first weapon of, “Just so you know, regarding that weapon you made, the faster the weapon, the more spell damage and the more melee attacks, but the less melee damage it performs. The slower the weapon, the weaker its spell damage, the less melee attacks, but the more melee damage it can perform. The types of weapons you use are entirely up to you and can change how you fight.” It isn’t a perfect quote, but it’s still more than what most early players know and would be informative without giving too much away.

A last set of changes I’d suggest to the item system should regard the elemental defense system that may be quite game-changing and a bit controversial. No offense, but even today, I have absolutely no idea what the base elemental defense values mean and if I have to get answers from other players instead of the game, it’s too complicated. I’d highly recommend changing these base values to instead be percentages that cap to 75%. The percentages that do exist would need massive changing to accommodate, but it’d be way better than what it is currently. Have where any elemental damage done is reduced by that percentage. Enemies can also use the same system and it’d be possible to have where the resistance percentage can be properly shown through modifications to the elemental symbols, where they give an idea of how resistant an enemy is to each element. Sure, it’d simplify the game a lot, but in all honesty, does it really need to be that complicated?

This was a long section so let me just put the suggestions here for the section for those interested:
-Lock new Mythics to Major Updates only. No random Mythics in a patch-sized update.
-Make current Sets more viable and add new Sets to help vary some of end-game instead of just Morph for new players.
-Move Elemental Relic Sets to Elemental Exercise as the reward and update both accordingly with the change.
-Have where when players first encounter IDs on items, it makes a chat message for them explaining how they function and saves the info to the quest book for future reference.
-Completely overhaul the Elemental Defense System to just be percentage-based with a cap of 75% and have enemies’ elemental resistances shown by different elemental symbols to indicate amount of resistance.

Spoiler: Bug Fixing

Yes, I’m going to have an entire section on what went wrong here too and possibly how to fix it.

The issue with bug fixing right now, is it is pretty much near nonexistent or non-effective. I have read mountains of bugs from people that have been mentioned and most aren’t fixed. Not going into depth on those as that’s not the focus. What is the focus is the lack of effective bug fixing. Right now, instead of squashing the bug/fixing the issue, they rip the house in two to deal with it (Mob Toteming). It’s terribly inefficient and wasteful. It also doesn’t help that at the rate bugs are handled, many more pop up. And that’s not including the fact the team keeps adding content pretty much doing the equivalence of tripling the bug count each time. That’s probably a pretty big overestimate, but it does give a good sense of the problem.

Let’s give an analogy to what’s happening for those not understanding. Let’s say you own a restaurant. It’s a little dirty and messy. You have a Neon sign in the back which is great for attracting customers even though it’s not in great condition given the number of wires just dangling around. The customers that are already there are constantly complaining about the food and environment and are hoping for that rare meal which is completely problem-free as it tastes better than the most exquisite food out there. They’re even willing to fight each other to get those meals and will constantly antagonize those who have had them. You and the restaurant staff, instead of fixing the problems through hiring an exterminator and cleaning the restaurant, decide to make 5 new dishes and add those to the menu, as well as plugging in the flashing Neon Sign to try and grab customers. People from a distance see the sign before the wires dangling around and think, “That seems like a cool restaurant, let’s go there!” When they get there, they see the wires dangling around and think, “Eh, could just be a small issue as it’s been a while.” They get in the restaurant, and it is filthier than imaginable for them and when they order, find that most of their food is covered in dirt and filled with bugs so they just leave without paying. You might consider this mean and distasteful of me to write (and I can promise you, I did not enjoy writing this analogy, not in the slightest), but this pretty much sums up the updates. It had issues and bugs prior to 1.20, but 1.20 didn’t fix most of any of this and instead just multiplied them and this update did almost the exact same.

I’m not saying that Wynncraft is beyond help with that, in fact, I gave a clear fix in that analogy so if you missed it, go back. I am saying spending some time to fix things would go a long way. This isn’t me saying that the team needs to just drop everything and fix every bug/issue before moving on. I am simply saying to spend some time fixing bugs or have people dedicated to doing just that instead of just rushing to the next content. Like in the analogy, anybody could’ve suggested the fix, the problem is actually performing the fix. It may cost time or some possible new players, but in the long run, Wynncraft needs to decide: Focus on just new content and only keep new players who may pay for some of your stuff, for at max a couple days, or choose to try and fix the issues to ensure player longevity in return for losing some ability to add new players for a while.

Now for the suggestion for Bug Fixing, have a group of people dedicated to just fixing bugs and issues. I’d call this section of the team, The Exterminators. This group would need one to two people who review bug reports and write down a list of bugs, level of significance, and how/where each bug/issue is taking place. The rest of the group would go through, and clear bugs/issues based on how significant they are and how common they are to happen. While this would not be the most fun process for a group of volunteers, understand that it’s needed. Nobody enjoys bug fixing, but it must be done. This team would need to be able to push patches at any given time that they finish a large number of bugs to ensure that they do not last until the next Update/Major Update.

Another suggestion is to make major changes to the testing servers, as has been recommended by others on the thread already. This would revolve around the ability to teleport to towns and cities with a command, having the ability to give yourself items, and level a class to whatever level it needs to be to test content. It would be a lot, but it’d help players test. It’s currently a nightmare to do so and nobody wants to do it as it’s beyond unreasonable at the moment. Incentivizing bug finding can be a good way of encouraging testing too though being careful with how much is being rewarded is crucial as well.

Spoiler: Conclusion

This was long, probably longer than I should’ve made it, but I feel it’s necessary for something like this as it’s pretty bad as it is right now. I did a player count check for the first 3 days of 1.20.4. First day it had almost 1500 and by end of Day 3, it was down to 1000. Now it’s barely 800-900 on any given day. While I get that players change out per day, that still means you have less than 1500 players actively playing on your server on a daily basis even with players changing out. For a server with this much work put into it already, that’s pretty miniscule. This server has almost as much effort as an actual game yet with a playerbase that is much smaller than most other servers. A while back, it almost seemed like things were starting to improve as the team had brought in a community manager to try and help with things, but as of now, it looks like nothing more than an act. I have seen next to nothing from them besides their entrance thread and one other thread (forgot exactly what it was) like a month or two after. This didn’t leave me with a warm and fuzzy feeling as it feels like they just saw the community and gave up. I’m not in the Discord because I just didn’t feel like being in it as I’m not the most social of people, so I don’t know what goes in there. If they’re active there, ignore my comments toward them. But if not, that’s a grave concern.

Salted, this part is directed at you for in case you are reading this thread but not commenting. I remember a long while back finding this server to be incredible. I used to be unable to wait to get back on after school and get back to doing stuff with some friends I played this with. I have a lot of good memories from this server even though I only got here like 2ish, almost 3 now, years ago. I can tell you do care about the game, but it isn’t showing at the moment. I have seen nothing but bad decisions for quite a while now and I honestly believe that a lot of this isn’t terribly hard to fix. I see you trying to make a good game that everyone can enjoy, but the problem is we don’t see what you’re trying to make. We can’t just know your plan. The community, for the most part, aren’t truly trying to make you out as the bad guy, they are simply just tired of feeling neglected and lashing out as a result of fatigue from asking you to fix the game to make it better. I made this entire post, not in the means to make you or the team out as the bad guys, but to point out there’s massive problems that need fixing. I add suggestions here and there on how to fix things, so it doesn’t feel like I’m just telling you to fix your own problems. I feel this server could be honestly on par with some of the biggest servers out there given the effort put in. But it’s not just about you and your team making this server, it’s about working with everyone to build an amazing server/game that everyone can enjoy. There will always be people unhappy with how things are and may not be happy with every change. At least trying to appease the people you can, is better than not appeasing anyone at all. And who knows, maybe those you do appease, can be the ones who help you appease those you didn’t. But you will never know until you try to do so.

For those wanting a TL;DR, let me just say this. If you’re too lazy to read even one section of this (some of these aren’t larger than a paragraph and ones you may have interest in, you don’t usually need a TL;DR anyways), ignore this entire post and move on.

 

Just I want to say I read all that, wasn't planning on it but it was really well written so good work, I feel like I probably disagree about some things, like I don't think hunted should mean there aren't any more challenges added until it's fixed, but I think my disagreements here are mostly nitpicks and aren't anything really worth arguing about.

For quests, hard agree on the zoom thing and especially the invulnerability, there are too many NPC's located near monsters for that to not be a feature. I strongly agree with the profession point as well, I've been saying this since 1.18 but there should really be cosmetics for when you reach level 100 in any gathering or profession and maybe something like a crown for when you hit level 100 in all of them. Gathering in this game is based on runescape and runescape has capes, I don't see why Wynn can't have capes too. They gave out cosmetics for the fyre fest or whatever it was called, they should do it for other objectives too.

For armor, I've been railing on this for a long time, especially in this thread so of course I agree with you, I think the best solution would be to start from ground zero but we know that's never happening again so I think the next best thing would be to embrace the fact that people don't like the system and introduce at least 5 monoelemental sets like morph with positive defenses and good but not great offensive stats and set bonuses which fall off the more you use of the set, that way it would be viable to run like 2 pc water and 6 for a biased dual elemental build or 4 and 4 for a perfect balance between two or maybe 4 and 2 and 2 for a tri elemental build. It wouldn't really fix the issue but it would at least give some choices for players who want an easy to understand build without being railroaded into using morph.

Finally for my hot take, emerald pouches were a meme for so long because everyone, literally every single person thought they were a bad idea, I was against them too but now that they're here I'm kind of curious what kind of chaos they're going to cause. Lootrunning just became a whole lot more popular and a whole lot more profitable, I'm curious to see how that's going to affect mythic prices in the long run so I kinda think they should stay. The economy is already kind of screwed, I don't think a little chaos right now is necessarily a bad thing.

 

I encourage everyone to read this.

 

ok

 

I fully agree with this, especially with the amount of money made from bonfire crates. I have issues with the dev team not being paid for their work, this could be due to the server upkeep costs being too high to do this, and if so that's fine, but for all we know salted could just be
pocketing all this money for himself (just to clarify, I'm perfectly fine with salted taking a decent wage for himself, I just think a portion of the money should be invested back into the dev team and the server itself.). We also very much need to have transparency in terms of future content,
because right now the game is very stale, and I feel like there isn't a lot of hope for the future. transparency would greatly help with that, and could result in a higher endgame player retention rate.

EDIT: Devs and admins appearently do get paid, it's only the CT which don't. which mostly invalidates what I said above, so nevermind.

Quests are not fun. They rarely have good gameplay and personally I don't care much for the story. The way quests are implemented doesn't make sense. They are meant to be "The main focus" of the game, but that makes absolutely no sense in an MMO. This would be fine in a singleplayer game, or a game
that's primarily story-driven, but wynncraft is (atleast, not for most) not that. I'm not saying quests are a bad thing or should be removed, but the gameplay severely needs to be improved upon and there should be a much smaller focus on quests going forward, as they are only fun to do the first time.
This is just my opinion, and it's probably a bad one to be honest. But oh well.

As for the first point, I can't say much as I've never been super involved in the prof community or proffing in general.
I completely agree there should be better rewards for warring. I'm currently in AVO and I have been for about 8 months. During my time here I've barely warred because it feels absolutely pointless. I thought the 1.20.3 guild seasons update would help that,
but due to the existance of alliances nothing changed.
I'll be completely honest, I was planning to level and alt and secretly attack SHY. the only reason I didn't was because I was too burnt out to level an alt. The reason I was planning to do this was because I really wanted the crown cosmetic, and I felt like the guild was completely locked out
of winning the season due to our alliances, I'm not well versed in guild politics, and I'm sure it's much more nuanced than "haha ally we cant attack them nope we'll just lose fuck you" but I still feel the existance of mega alliances, or even alliances in general is super counterproductive
to what the guild warring system could have been. Additionally, the gameplay of wars currently seems very flawed. It's way too easy to take territories, to the point where it really just becomes a game of who has enough time to keep warring until the other guild gets bored. In the few circumstances the other guild
does get bored, allies just take over and maintain the territories. Guild warring upsets me because it has so much potential to be the endgame/competitive content we've needed for such a long time. But the system is so flawed it makes it feel entirely pointless and unfun.

Not knowledgeable about profs/the prof community to comment on this.

Raids are buggy, but in my opinion aren't that bad. As far as I'm aware there aren't any bugs that can softlock your classes and thats really all that matters. Raid bugs are something that should be addressed but aren't super high priority.

I don't think a new challenge mode would really help the state the game is currently in. Leaderboards would be cool though.

I never liked unlevelled lootrunning, it never really made sense and having to class after each chest made it much more tedious. That being said the lack of places to lootrun right now is very bad for the game. We need either client-side chests, or more places to be able to get mythics.

An alternative to lootrunning is a good thing, but having it be pay to win (especially to the extend that it was) is a very bad thing. I would be fine if mob grinding was viable without mob totems, but slightly more efficient with. I haven't really used mob totems much since 1.20.4, so I might not fully
know enough to comment on this, but I think the mob totem nerf is not the issue. I think mob totems being a very small boost for people willing to pay for ranks is fine. I just think base mob spawn rates need to be buffed to compensate.

Emerald pouches would be nice if they didn't severely nerf emerald drop rates in the process. I partially agree that there are too many emerald sinks right now,
although I think the real issue is the fact that there are almost no ways to generate emeralds, not the fact that there are a lot of ways to spend them.



also sorry for any bad grammar/punctuation, I fucking hate english and refuse to learn how to actually use it correctly. I hope you take this seriously inspite of it.

sorry if any of this comes off as arrogant or mean spirited, that wasn't my intention. all of this comes from a place of care for the game.

If any of my points were unclear let me know and I'll try to elaborate.



thanks for coming to my ted talk

 

Bump cuz staff needs to acknowledge this

 

For me: fix the grind first, then do it.

1) toggle whenever
2) ct said it is impossible

devs and admins get paid, CT don't (just wanted to clear up)

 

thanks for letting me know, I'll edit my response

 

since it's come up a few times I'll give my thoughts on it: while I do really hope the admins or ct managers comment here, I can understand if they take some time because it's better to have a good response than a rushed one that might leave more people upset. I genuinely do expect this thread to be commented on at some point by Salted or Hams though, even if it may take a bit.

Still, it would really be nice to increase communication, whether its through monthly update, more community manager updates, more player and ct/staff relations, more acknowledgment of the feedback section, or just about anything really. This has always been THE #1 issue in Wynncraft in my opinion and it feels especially necessary now that updates seem more frequent than ever.

 

not possible salted needs his lambo and 3 mansions