The Least Optimizable Build In Wynn And Why Reworks Are Needed

So we're gonna ignore the much wider range, the easy repeatability, the speed-lowering, jump-preventing Earthquake upgrade, and the ease of being able to use other powder specials then? Okay.

 

Black is a potential facebook friend

________________________________

I'm not super sure what you mean here, could you rephrase?

 

I have never encountered a situation where the jump-prevention of bash was useful in all my time playing warrior not to mention the fact that quake could be used to actually combo since it doesn't knock mobs

Could also be used to slow mobs to halt their movement

 

Exactly. When is jump prevention useful in the slightest? And @Selvut283 with replacing warrior's RLR with quake, you'd still have the repeatability.

 

just reduce knockback and make it so uppercut doesnt launch people to the moon and, BOOM! issue fixed!

 

Or quake since nobody has a problem with an aoe spell that stunlocks everything and gives no knockback

 

e x a c t l y

________________________________

thatworkstoo

 

i mean, i don't really endorse changes, but imo if you had to do something, make it so the second hit of bash knockback freezes (like ice snake) instead and reduce uppercut air time

 

That's much less of a radical change, I think selvut would like that even though he does radical changes to items all the time lol
also 69th post

 

Nice

 

First off, give us a new Earth Powder special then. Swapping it out for Bash doesn't work.

Second off, that goes against Warrior's point of being the knockback-centric, wide-hitting, taunt-prone tank. Its main spell would suddenly have a shorter range than Spin Attack. Plus, we'd have to severely reduce Quake's damage(615% damage for your main spell? Hi, stronger spell than Mage!) and knocking mobs UP makes it look a little more impressive, sure, but knocking mobs AWAY has a lot more actual utility early-game.

You seem to say Quake stunlocks, but it doesn't. It doesn't inflict Blindness, which is the "stunlock" effect given. What it does, is it inflicts a small amount of upwards knockback. And, with that, you ignore the speed-reducing effect also mentioned.

 

First, let's go with the powder specials. Here are some ideas:
1. a gravity style attack that pulls mobs towards you in a radius and inflicts damage
2. a mini uppercut/arrow shield style spell, causing spikes of earth to come up, inflicting a poison like bleed status effect and slowness (that may work as an RLR as well)
3. a jackhammer/ground pound ability that stuns all enemies in range for an extended amount of time

Next, where does it say that warrior is knockback centric? I suggest a modified quake, not straightup quake. A spell like quake with the same range and damage as bash, but with different effects would work much better in wars. Even if it were to stun or knock them up all in an area it would be useful as opposed to earlygame utility. The knockback of bash doesn't do anything for you after level 30.

And the current effects are fine of quakelol

 

Sure "wide-hitting" could be useful but knockback is extremely situational and typically works against the player. Also where does the "taunt prone"-ing come into play as far as I know that is not a feature currently.

As for quake, like you said damage multiplier has to be significantly decreased, and in terms of controling the crowd, knocking mobs slightly upwards and giving them heavy slowness is perfect for a spell that both cripples mobs without making it unfair(unlike blindness) and provides s o m e combo potential since the mobs don't get launched. And like you said

This is the problem I at least want to fix. If you want to keep a knockback based playstyle, uppercut already exist and does it's job fine by getting rid of mobs in the crowd. But including bash is redundant to the knockback playstyle and a lot of people feel similarly.

________________________________

Or just replace uppercut with quake since it's purpose would be for damage/cc and the early game knockback in bash could still be utilized.

 

can i marry you

 

No homo

 

no homo but ily

________________________________

Also, what's the point of knockback if warrior is literally meant to be tanky and ENDURE HITS

________________________________

also @Selvut283 with your taunt tank logic, Archer is supposed to be support because it gives speed

 

Earth's theming as its abilities are "Deal strong, slow, heavy hits." With that in mind...

Gravity fails to follow that theming, as manipulating knockback is air's domain.
Number two was actually rejected initial draft for the earth powder special in development.
If we do this, then we need to get rid of Escape, as that's suddenly redundant as well. Got a good replacement for Escape?

Let's look at the facts, and compare.

Warrior spells:
Bash? Decent horizontal knockback, wide AOE so can hit lots of foes, only knocks directly backwards
Charge? Decent horizontal knockback, covers lots of ground and has deceptively high range, so can hit lots of foes, knocks in any direction
Uppercut: Low-ish horizontal knockback, high vertical knockback, can hit decent amt of foes, corrals them into roughly the same area due to forcing enemies into the same orientations
War Scream: Broken at the moment; it fails to feature its initial hit and gives Air Shout initially instead of having it as an upgade. This aside, both effects have very very high horizontal knockback, knocks away from casting area

Archer spells:
Arrow Storm? Fairly high knockback, primarily compounded by range, knocks in any direction, must be hit by projectile
Escape? No knockback
Bomb Arrow: Minimal knockback, knocks in any direction, fairly wide AOE so can hit lots of foes
Arrow Shield: Decent horizontal knockback, low-decent vertical knockback, knocks away from casting area, okay-ish range

Mage spells:
Heal? Can't hit enemies
Teleport: No knockback
Meteor: Low horizontal knockback, knocks in any direction, very wide AOE so can hit lots of foes
Ice Snake: Minimal knockback, only knocks directly backwards, directable AOE so can hit lots of foes

Assassin Spells:
Spin Attack: Minimal knockback, knocks away from casting area, okay-ish range
Vanish? Can't hit enemies
Multihits: Decent horizontal+vertical knockback, directable, extremely small range
Smoke Bomb: No knockback, small AOE

Seeing a pattern here? Archer and Assassin do have methods of knocking enemies away, but they're much less directable than Warrior's, or harder to hit with and more damage-focused.

War Scream's entire point is to taunt, but it's broken right now so its taunt doesn't come into play. Mobs re-aggro by who hits them most recently, so a skill that can hit all foes in an area will naturally draw attention, and with how wide-hitting Charge and Bash are, it's very easy to draw aggro away after a friend does something like Multihits or similar. Plus, given how many hits that the Air Shout inflicts in such a short time, it's a great "focused" taunt that deals respectable damage while also practically guaranteeing you'll get the guy you're fighting back on your case.

Uppercut gives everyone a break by letting you take a nip of a potion or a heal, and since it has three hits it's likely that the mob in question will re-aggro to the Warrior who Uppercutted them, which gives everyone else a chance to recoup and regroup.

________________________________

 

Thought that war scream did something like that, but never noticed it come into play cause like you said, was broken. As for the mobs targeting the player that hit them last I haven't noticed that effect come into play from when I ran group LI or wars that much but I'll see effective that is.

 

According to what Salted and JP have told us regarding this, mobs just have a chance to re-aggro to whoever hit them per hit. So, owner and coder. How reliable it is is debatable, but the intent is quite clear.

 

Good job. You just stated that warrior's obsolete. You deadass are listing every other class is better. With uppercut, if you pot while the mob is in the air, you stop the spell and let the mob fall, letting them r e g e n. If you don't get hit, there's no point to having defense and being a tank is there? Arrow Shield has the same range as spin attack, and extreme knockback, which you can direct by as you say, W A L K I N G F O R W A R D. Right now, all warrior spells are suited for archer, because they knock mobs away to keep you alive. IN ADDITION TO THIS, bash and warscream do the exact same thing, except one buffs the user. With your uppercut logic, it'd be better on mage because you can just heal.

You state that earth is for strong, slow, heavy hits, but the earth mythic meta right now is literally fast earth weapons with the likes of super fast attack speed gaia, stunlock grimtrap, alka (similar to gaia), and grandmother spam/mana steal. None of these are slow by any means, and a different powder special could help with this

Also, speaking of air being knockback, try making wind prison useful. then we can talk "knockback"

________________________________

Unrelated, my friend SlashTheDragon_ gave me an idea of warscream being a huge area ability that deals a single damage to aggro, that could work too, and also buffs