The Least Optimizable Build In Wynn And Why Reworks Are Needed

Hello friends, I've noticed a few people like Lego_DW and Wynn: The Anime do this, but here's my take on it. As an experienced Warrior in WC and tank player in many other games, I believe I'm relatively qualified to talk about this.

Warrior is obviously the "tank" or "heavy" class in Wynncraft. And for tanks in all scenarios, two things are needed: Resistances and Area Denial. Warrior clearly has the former, as it has the most natural defense, yet other classes can still reach this defense like the "rogue" style class of Assassin, and even mage at times. And besides being boring and having a generic Ignition, Apoc, or even Alka melee, warrior's spells don't cover area denial as well as they should. Archer's Arrow Shield and Bomb spell work much better, because they have more damage and more range. Bomb has an effective range of a Smoke Bomb or a Meteor in a lot of cases, but is much better.

The main area denial that Warrior has is the Bash spell, the first spell the player unlocks in the game. Bash however is quite... useless in most scenarios within wynn. The thing about Bash is that it has quite a lot of natural knock back, making it impossible to deal enough damage, especially when against a boss or in a guild war. There are stats like Walk Speed that can combat this to an extent, but usually only against a boss. In a guild war, where there are effective Mini Bosses with 70k+ health, bashing, knocking enemies back and giving them a chance to regenerate before they come at you again isn't effective in the slightest. Uppercut isn't much better. While Uppercut deals more damage than Bash and can still hit multiple targets (but then again, every spell in the game can hit multiple targets with the exception of vanish), it knocks mobs way too high to be considered useful, especially in a guild war. Even though there's constant damage, it's not enough to stop health regeneration or the dreaded ranged attack from a Sniper or Bishop, and still doesn't have constant damage like with Arrow Storm or Multihit.

While these knockback based abilities would be good in a scenario on defense like holding a point in a Domination/Payload/Hardpoint style game, they're ineffective and inefficient in a guild war, making wars unsurvivable or take up to hours on end.

These are just some of the Warrior spell builds I've used and had difficulty soloing.
Earth Spell: https://wynndata.tk/s/kt4DN3
Steam (Water/Fire) Spell: https://wynndata.tk/s/e310KE AND https://wynndata.tk/s/BRwegA
Thunder Spell: https://wynndata.tk/s/oX91vc
Magma (Earth/Fire) Spell: https://wynndata.tk/s/RA0Zy9

I propose three options for changes:

1. The Knockback Stat
As most of you know, sprinting and performing a melee hit causes Knockback. And some mobs, when you happen to use Bash or War Scream come towards you as opposed to getting knocked back. I believe that there could be a stat based off of this. Negative Knockback % would cause mobs to come towards you, and positive could make them get, well, knocked back.

2. Nerf Archer, Buff Warrior
I've recently started playing Archer, and noticed a huge problem in my mind. The effective range of bomb is much too high for a lightweight sniper-like class, and works even better than the actual tank area denial spells. This needs to be stopped immediately. If Bash had more range and less knockback, similar to Spin Attack, it could become so much better, and to balance that, Bomb would have reduced range.

3. Rework Bash + Upper Entirely
I haven't put as much thought into this, but I believe that a Bash and Uppercut rework could be an extremely viable option for wars as opposed to the current Warrior.

 

honestly, I agree. Warrior as a class in general is lacking. compared to the other classes it’s damage is horrid and mage with heal is more tanky making warrior the worst class.

 

I've been playing spell-warrior for awhile and frankly I have no idea what people are complaining about with Bash. I'm using it even far more than I'm using Uppercut for damage cause it can hit so quickly and reliably; you just have to aim with it. Catching enemies towards the front of it guarantees you'll get the second hit, unless the enemy takes a lot of extra knockback, such as the Flesh Eaters in Sand-Swept Tomb.

 

Exactly the point. Other classes do warrior's job even better. Assassin can reach the defense and have the area denial with Smoke Bomb and Spin Attack, Archer has the total area denial with every spell besides Arrow Storm, Mage can be tanky af with Heal, and use Meteor for area denial, leaving Warrior in the dust.

 

In before people say walls exist

Negative knockback would hinder builds that are glassy, so negating knockback from spells like bash (upper should stay the same imo) would be more suited.

Archer nerf not needed, the defense penalty already cripples archer in most scenarios and while bomb more than makes up for it, there is no need at the current moment.

Viable option for wars and bosses**

 

I disagree, warrior isn't lacking. It has ineffectiveness in guild wars, sure. But if you really think about it it isn't about warrior being weak in spells as much as it is the guild war system lacking. It's just a spam of 1000 mobs on you, of course knockback wouldn't work too great.

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They're talking about guild wars, warrior is fine but imo the wars are flawed.

 

While the knockback is useful in certain cases like dungeons with lots of squishies, it sucks when attacking bosses and in guild wars specifically, which is the main point here. I know that Bash is reliable in dunegons and warring 50s-70s, but it has low base damage and too much knockback to often be useful in higher level war settings. Not to mention Bash doesn't always instakill lv50s in war, so it takes forever.

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While the negative kb would hinder glassy builds, it would add another pricepoint/option for other classes.
Archer is easily the best class right now for anything, and bomb + arrow shield makes it so you're practically untouchable. When commonly combined with walkspeed, archer can war and take little to no damage in more than a few cases.

 

There is nothing you can do to follow up the damage with bash unless you invest walk speed or expend mana with charge both of which are unreliable for racking damage especially when compared to the options that other classes can offer.

 

I disagree, bash is super useful and can help you corner bosses really easily.

 

The main point here is the inefficiency in wars, and often in boss fighting scenarios like LI. When questing and roaming about the world, I love Warrior.

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And knock them through the wall, causing you to need to /class

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^

 

I understand wars, But I've never had a run in with bash knocking a boss through a wall. I've only had instances of that with Uppercut

 

Also good luck with flamethrowers, arrow storms, multihits, and other k n o c k b a c k b a s e d m o b a t t a c k s

 

Wars is a whole topic of how they force to build around heavy mana sustain and crazy def/agi which I agree should be changed and is hopefully being changed. Regardless in really open boss arenas with the addition of bosses having ranged attacks/heavy mobile spells, spell warrior lacks greatly from not being able to output damage fast enough.

 

i haven't seen many problems with warrior spell to be honest (just quoting this post because i can), although i agree that with wars, warrior has some problems

most bosses either have:
low knockback: no problems with warrior there imo
high knockback: keeps you safe, easy to corner for high dps (i can't think of any extremely big areas for boss fights, works fine in LI)
negative knockback: same as low knockback, except warrior is imo better than archer for -kb since arrow storm no longer is a safe option (just drags the boss onto your face, then hello -base defense) for many builds

as for wars, warrior is pretty subpar, but still viable.

uppercut

 

Huh. Weird. I've ran LI quite a few times and bash has near always knocked them into a wall or off the platform in the case of Matrojan Idol. Also when dealing with Hive Bosses, and even Qira herself, they've glitched through walls.

 

...just...walk forward and keep using Bash. It's honestly more efficient than Uppercut because there's less wait-time; it's more spammable than Uppercut and deals more damage in less time. Bash-Bash-Uppercut is a super smooth combo that will also let your mana regenerate...

130% base damage twice is 260% damage total. I've not found any situation outside of a few select mobs with high negative knockback, or mobs that take lots of normal knockback, where Bash isn't useful. If anything Uppercut needs a damage bump to be more competitive compared to Bash, but I'd like you all to remember something:



Maybe, just maybe, there's a reason why its spells aren't the best.

 

Regen lol
Arrow storm knocks mobs back, you can also just arrow shield especially if using a wynn mod where each spell has a single hotkey
Low KB = knocked through walls
High KB = never gonna kill him or you, specifically with spell
Negative KB = often more damage will be dealt to you, but also to the boss, this is actually a good scenario

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No shit, warrior's supposed to be tankish, but I think war optimization is pretty shitty, and vastly un preferable. I've war trained people who want to use warrior, and it's a pain for both me and them. Also uppercut lets their health regen. Remember as well this is mainly a guild war post.

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Yep. Wars are a vastly different meta than Dungeons *cough @Selvut283 cough*

 

low lb: i can see that even if it hasn't happened to me in a situation where i had to restart boss (boss usually was able to walk/come out eventually)
high kb: doesn't happen too often (i guess it might happen in high ele def + low pierce situations)

 

No one is arguing bash is less effective than uppercut, it is the fact that most mobs take too much knockback, even in the overworld, do just "walk up to them" much less for it to combo.

I'm sure that explains how far assassins can throw smoke bombs with that one box of range

 

I get that high kb doesn't happen often in boss scenarios with the exception of air bosses, FF boss, and a few LI mobs, but it still isn't preferable.
Regarding Low KB, it's all down to personal experiece, and i've had a lot of that with this specific scenario.

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yea there are huge discrepancies in that shit, mage has like -643754 spell damage compared to assassin or archer yet 5 boxes in "spell"