Post 1.20.4 thoughts on Wynncraft

First I'll start off with a small introduction of who I am so you can better understand my point of view and can rationalize why I may feel certain ways on aspects of the 1.20.4 update.

My IGN is TravisNH, I have been playing Wynncraft for 7 years (since pre-gavel) and have a lot of experience in every community; Questing, Professions, Guilds, Lootrunning, Mob Grinding, Raiding, Dungeons, Challenge Modes, and just really anything else.

https://wynncraft.com/stats/player/TravisNH

This thread was inspired by a whole lot of people complaining in the #Wynncraft channel in the official Wynncraft discord and I just wanted a more centralized, formal, and well put together way of expressing our opinions. Plus this is more likely to be read by someone who can make changes.

I'll provide a tldr, but here are the detailed criticisms:

The Wynncraft Team needs to be more transparent with the community.

Quests:
- The new implementation of how quest dialogue is delivered to the player is not optimal or wanted. Holding your sneak key to progress through dialogue is a much slower and problematic way of reading dialogue. Often, I am doing a quest on my 10th class and DO NOT want to read it. I prefer the old system of clicking through it all. This has to be changed for me to ever do a quest again for fun.
- Certain level gaps are missing meaningful lore in quests and are just fetch quests with no meaning.
- There is still no endgame quest.
- Areas in the game that have been in the game for so long still do not have secret discoveries (Dernal Jungle, Ocean).

Guilds:
- Guilds need to be removed completely from being associated with the Profession and Levelling communities or need better game mechanics than a territory boost that is exclusive to people in the guild. I can't speak much for combat boosting but profession boosting has ruined and destroyed what was left of the dying professions community. Crokee has quit and so have other mods in the community, and more other core community players.
- Guilds need to have better rewards for warring. Warring is the most draining and you receive only a few cosmetics and up to half and LE and a few guild tomes. Warring takes so many good items, consumables and time and effort and work for it to pay off and the outcome never worth it.
- There should not be "attacking" and "defending" guilds as there should not be mega alliances at all in my opinion but this is the case throughout most of Wynn history, attackers need more opportunities to feel like they did something on the map. As it is right now, attacking is extremely difficult, way too time consuming and fruitless.

Professions:
- Remove territorial boosts.
- Offer better content over new content. I'm not saying make doing professions more easy but to make it more interesting. Listen to feedback on this please.
- Make professions hard again. Adding GXP armor/accessories was needed since professions were so time consuming to level up but it makes players who did them without GXP feel terrible and their achievements undermined.

Raids:
- Do not add any features to raids until bugs are fixed. I would even go as far to suggest removing raids from guild and personal objectives until raid bugs are fixed.

Challenge Modes:
- Challenge modes are a great way for players to experience Wynn in a new way but challenge modes have not seen anything new/exciting in a long time.
- add a new challenge mode.
- add a challenge mode leaderboard.

Lootrunning:
- Add back unlevelled runs, chests are now crowded and some even level to the wrong level.
- OR maybe don't add back unlevelled lootrunning but please offer an alternative to it.

Mob Grinding:
- Totems should to be given to players without ranks. How this is done I do not know.
- They are so overpowered and nerfing them just because a small percentage of players found a good way to use them to get way too many mythics and ingredients doesn't mean you should nerf them for everyone.

Economy:
- Adding Emerald pouches is nice, the timing of them being added in Wynncraft being in such an economical low just looked like a patch for an even bigger problem.
- There are too many emerald sinks. Too many places to delete and use up all your emeralds. Market, Horses, Merchants, IDing items, Guild Warring, Bank space.

TLDR: Wynncraft needs to fix its bugs and internal issues before adding more content to the game.

PLEASE VOTE ON THE SMALL POLL ABOVE BUT ALSO GO INTO DETAIL ON YOUR OPINION.
This was just what I thought but I need the whole communities thoughts on these points too. Please do not personally attack anyone and do not post meaningless things.

not everything here is my complete opinion, this is partially what I have observed from all the communities I've been a part of.

 

yeah this tbh wynncraft is slowly becoming very broken and unfun/unrewarding

 

tldr ^

It was so good until this part hit. It's an argument with no basis that's only justified by the elitist attitude of "we put in the hours, you should too" for a system that should be more open, not less. If profs were account based instead of class based, I'd agree, but they're not and won't be changed like that.
Oh but if you mean giving some sort of recognition like a star for pre-nerf prof high lvls then definitely.

Other than that, pretty broad agree. Also buff quest rewards...

 

I think Wynn as a server needs to take time and relook how it’s progressing, I don’t know what they have planned but as it stands I feel they’re limiting content by focusing on pushing out this new thing or that new thing (such as emerald pouches, or gxp bonuses, or even the mob totem changes) without really looking at it in a way to make a positive change but rather to temporarily patch up the holes until it tears again. Wynn becomes very draining due to the limited and, ultimately broken, content, and they seemingly keep removing any semblance of a reward for it. I’m not someone who does much in most communities or as invested as some other people, but I’ve invested a large sum of my time into this server and it feels consistently as though these new updates undermine the servers own positive changes it does make. I’d rather them spend the time fixing and redeveloping different things (such as they’ve stated they wanted to look into for lootrunning, which was iirc making it person based in some way rather than global) while listening to what people actually want than pushing out new content like they did the new mythics. UlTiMaTeLy this was a bit of a meaningless rant, but, the server itself feels like it’s killing its own ability to be enjoyed over a longer time, and it greatly upsets me :(

I’m drained, and just lootrunning in now overly diluted chests isn’t rewarding.

 

reserving the slot for my message while i type it

 

Good post, however, I am too dumb, and

Spoiler

your mother

 

Guilds:
Honestly. There have been so many rants in glstaff about attacking that I feel sick repeating it all, attacking is pointless, expensive, tiring, and a waste of time. The bias towards defenders for better rewards because "holding is hard" is ridiculous

Profession Boost:
Ever since PROF lost se I don't see it used much anymore but the damage is done

Challenge modes:
Yeah please add a leaderboard in Detlas or something. Add new gamemodes (cough Elemental and Brutal). Ironman quest item pouch. Give people who complete HIC some recognition because its way more trouble than its worth

 

wynncraft endgame content

 

too long didn’t read + been here longer than you + don’t care just enjoy the game + ratio

 

As someone who has been on both sides of the Mega alliance coin I mostly agree with what's being said. I do think mega alliances are very oppressive to guilds that are not in the alliance and are very unfun for anyone who's not in a guild in a mega alliance. For the most part it's either be good enough to get invited to the alliance or just never feel like you're actually doing anything when it comes to wars. I think that if they do something to make alliances less powerful they may indirectly fix the first problem listed. Of course, that comes at a cost because either way one party is unhappy.

 

I don't agree with everything here (mainly stuff relating to gxp and totems), but I think you make a lot of good points on Wynncraft's current state. I would definitely prefer a 1.21 that focuses on fixing (or at least attempting to fix) the game's issues rather than like quest revamps or something

 

I will always disagree with this as probably the only person on Wynn, I prefer the new dialogue system, and I've done all quests using it on like 11 classes.

Ye these things should be improved upon

Even though this is probably an unpopular opinion, I wish guilds were more about the community and less about the warring. Honestly, I wouldn't mind if Warring was removed completely. I think that mega alliances are broken and should not exist, it's literally impossible to fight against them, at least as a single guild. The example I can give is the guild my friend is in. They managed to wipe one big guild off the map in a quick sweep, but guess what, in a matter of like 20 minutes, 5 guilds collapsed on them, and a few hours later, all of the territories was back in the hands of the original guild. How are you supposed to fight that?

-

Regarding professions, I can't comment too much on them, as I haven't really done them, but I'll say that even with GXP, profs are still way too grindy for me lol. Even with full GXP gear and double prof bombs I couldn't handle the grind at only like lvl 70. I just despise profs.

Yes, they should either add back unlvled runs or offer an alternative, 100% agree. I know that saying "add client-side chests" is way too simple and would bring its own problems, but I think it's definitely an idea that should be toyed with.

 

rare beef miss


counter ratio

 

ok clash royale virgin

 

i agree on guild they are the sole reason i still play eipc post travis nh

 

I'm a much newer player (started like 3 years ago but didnt get past midgame until a few months back where i properly started playing) so i dont really have much of an opinion on the past features.

I couldn't agree more with all the points on quests and more secret discoveries can literally only get a positive reception seeing as they arent a necessity but are still sick lore.

I feel like warring has been completely ignored in 1.20.4, with the changes to skill pots making them only really worth using for hqs at this point. They were already a massive money drain but having to use consumables instead is going to make warring in an off map guild successfully next to impossible other than maybe ffas. Theres the option of making some consum ingredients easier to obtain but that could end badly if done wrong. All this together just makes warring as an off map a bad decision.

Prof boosts: w h y
PROF holding se was already bad enough but taq milked this in the dxp weekend too. It's just a mess that you can speed up a process by being in a guild. (Also profs are just useless in general. You can just get someone else to craft the stuff for you. The only real incentive for profing is to charge people for the craft or to flip materials into items from the trade market)

With raids i completely disagree. The 1.20.4 party finder changes are a good contribution to the wait times and so are the guild objectives. pre 1.20.4, the wait times were way more of an issue than the bugs in the raids (excluding notg but its notg). The bugs definitely need fixing so i agree with not adding stuff to it but definitely dont remove the guild objective.

The removal of unlevelled lootrunning would have been fine like a year ago but way too many people lootrun now. It is way too crowded and its why people used unlevelled or resorted to mob grinding. There needs to be a way for endgame players to utilise the rest of the map for lootrunning so that it isnt crowded and unlevelled was a good temporary solution to that. Id say keep it until a different solution is found.

Literally every player can agree the shortage in raw le is a massive problem. With some mythic boots being cheaper than decent legendary rolls and other mythic weapons following soon, something needs to be done asap.

 

yea i agree with almost all of this, as much as i dont have as much experience with the community at large i have certainly tried almost all aspects of the game to some extent. (ive spent far to many hrs playing this game over the last 2-3 years)
https://www.wynndata.tk/stats/player/VHoltz_

As far as lootrunning goes either add back unlvld or have client side chests, and cap them to being about 3 hrs old. itll fix all the issues with people being toxic around "snipers" it will make mythic rates far more consistent, as before either you ran normal lrs and had 2k drys, or you ran unlvld if you knew about it and had basically free 5hr old chests and i know that personally my average drys dropped from 2.1k to about 600.

Quests and Raids just need to be fixed, its been far to long. Ive personally put off doing much of the content as it has no meaning to it, many of the quests give little reward and even those that do for example rol 1-5 is just far to painful to do even with the reward of being able to do nol, maybe i could justify it if the sp tomes were more consistent but doing 10 raids for maybe 2 tomes is just not worth it.

Guilds as far as profs goes, i completely agree. gxp stuff is already enough add on top of that guild prof boost makes end game gatherings stupidly fast, and as someone who did profs before that point (only to max useful but still) after doing gatherings on multiple other classes it became immediately apparent how broken just the gxp set alone is.
In regards to terr mob xp boost imo it should only affect the xp if you are grinding guild xp and not personal xp.
Guild wars are also incredibly pointless now, once you have your claim there is little benefit to warring further, especially with the sr degradation once you hold more terrs, and most of the rewards being completely ass. like you say the time and effort for making and specialising builds, the fact that optimal builds are often reliant on mythics, crafting consumables, especially now that sp pots got nerfed into the ground. all just serves to demotivate me from wars, before my reason for warring was the fact there was 1 a leader board via tracking wars on the api and 2 it was fun to mess around with guild members with stupid builds, sure it was brainless but it was more a tool for entertaining oneself in vcs.
Now wars have such a high req to get into them, needing more than just morph, which makes it hard to encourage guild members to war with many builds requiring other quest content ect. they killed the spirit of old wars.
Unfortunately i dont really see a fix to removing mega alliances its worked that way for so long and guilds will find a way to make it work.

Regarding mob totems and mythic grinding, i tried avos when that became public but due to the massive amount of lag it was unusable for me, when i tried snails it was the first time i was seriously grinding mobs, i had around 3hrs of totems on various accounts. once you scale it up like that i can see the issues, but for general players doing 4 totems a day i dont see the issue with it, its only once you can use totems on mass that it becomes broken.
Totems in general have become required for any sort of mob grinding party, theres just no better way to lvl especially with content being as buggy as it is rn, unless you have access to whatever guild currently owns sky/corkus.

On a personal note ive been feeling more and more demotivated to play with the constant bugs and glitches that are introduced and not fixed in subsequent updates, it hurts to see that they are just adding more and more to the game without focusing on making the game a bugless enjoyable experience, be that for the first play through or after your 10th class.

 

Not often is it that I write on the forums, but I believe my time has come.

The guild system is an extremely convoluted and complex system that has far too many moving parts to summarise. For proof of this, please ask any person who actively frequents guilds to describe war and war mechanics, territories, economy and alliances in less than 200 words. There's a reason Guild wiki page has so much outdated information. The only truly public full guide on guilds (that isn't presented with a clickbait style and terrible advice) is a 23 page document.

I will now discuss developer communication (developer communication [developer communication]), an extremely touchy subject for many! Looking at the changes made in 1.20.4, they honestly seem like non-changes. While it does slightly nerf the amount of SR larger guilds tend to get, it doesn't actually address the issue of being unable to catch up to higher SR guilds by purely attacking. This is important because the majority of attackers get served a 3 course meal of ganking from several guilds at once, meaning they're unable to hold for longer than 1-2 hours in most cases, meaning they don't get the hourly SR benefit that defenders do.

Here's a diagram.



Basically, "attackers" get 20 SR for taking 1 territory, whereas "defenders" get 20 SR every hour for... not doing anything.
To put it in terms many players would understand, it's like someone using an account to auto-lootrun and get free mythics with 0 effort required other than setting up the bot and getting hundreds of mythics compared to manually lootrunning and getting only a handful.

Also to make this shorter, new changes made HQs unable to drysnipe (meaning capture the territory without any other territories owned by that guild being captured), resource generation higher for longer held territories (treasury (basically more stuff for holding for longer (meaning if you literally afk and get lucky enough to not be attacked you get free rewards (going back to the lootrun example, it's as if the bot account got 20% higher chance to find mythics. not as high as that but you get the idea (hopefully))))) and lowered territories taxes cap (meaning resources (territory stuff) does not drain (get stolen by the enemy guild) as fast (was 80%, now 40% (meaning theoretically twice as slow to drain))).

So why have these changes been added?



Dev eloper com unifications

Developer communications. Developer communications has been the most bipolar thing in the guild community. At points, Guild-Staff Communications (glstaff) has gone weeks without a single word from developers, for it to all of a sudden be bursting with the seams with communication ranging from Q&As to just discussions of new features. Around a week before the season was set to end, Salted suddenly rushed onto the scene and described these fanatical new SR changes, with a discussion lasting around 2 hours taking place discussing the idea, and days later a 2-3 day Q&A session with HeyZeer0 (wynntiles owner (also developer)) about (mainly) new changes.



At some points, I understand how difficult it is to brainstorm, flesh out, develop and balance guild ideas are. I can say from experience (research idea, state system, off-season events) that it is extremely difficult to get a clear concensus from guild leaders.

Also alliances kinda suck tbh but are impossible to avoid so L
Wars gave me like 5+stx from doing nothing so I guess that's a reward.

As people before me and probably after me will and have said, community features (motd, tower training, custom events, better rewards, guild housing, and skirmish (basically open world pvp (with custom settings and in an offmap area (where your guild can duel privately))) are all great ideas (suggested by me btw) that should at least be considered). Also territory bonuses suck (particularly for PvP).

also ignore the embed fails i do not use forums

otherwise skill issue

 

I actually like the new dialogue system, and it allows me to actually read dialogue(because I actually appreciate the story of Wynn) without new dialogue popping up before I'm finished. Although, there should absolutely be a way to skip dialogue and cutscenes, and just a rework to RoL 3 in general.

Also, as far as I know, I'm fairly sure that the "endgame quest" you are looking for is called "A Hunter's Calling"

This, I agree with. I haven't experienced many wars, but I know how messed up warring is, and IMO te territory control/warring system needs to be completely revamped. I seriously doubt that guilds were designed for a huge alliance to take over the map.

While I mostly agree with the first two(Hypixel Skyblock's skill system is definitely better than Wynn's professions, one of the few things that is), the third one is a terrible idea, with an even worse justification. Essentially, you're just saying "Professions were made easier, so now they have to be made harder." Even now, I still feel like professions are too grindy and rely on dxp/speed bombs to even progress at a close to reasonable rate. If anything, professions need to be easier, not harder.

Honestly, raids should just be removed from objectives permanently.

Saying "Add a new challenge mode" does nothing if you don't actively suggest a new one. We all know the community wants more challenge modes, but you can't just say "make a new one" and have the devs do all the work.

I genuinely don't get the drama about unlevelled chests, but if they were removed there's likely a good reason for it. Iirc its something about chests in some regions giving loot of your level, and not the chest's, so if that's the case, then I think it was a good change.

Totems are really one of those things that border very close on the edge of p2w. Maybe if you were rewarded a totem for completing your daily objective, and then ranked players just got more, but outright giving ranked players like 6 totems a day is way too powerful.

Again, I'm not really involved with the economy much(i have about 50 LE to my name), so I can't really make any opinions about this, but I agree there are way too many money sinks and not enough ways to get money.