Does Anyone Else Find Lari Extremely Annoying

Throughout the first 3 light quests that I've completed, I find her as the bully instead of the victim. She was strapped to her morals, insisting to not kill when the creature was clearly intending harm---she also directly caused the execution of Dullahan. After causing hundreds of people to suffer and die, she somehow STILL insists on finding a cure, a fact that I personally find astounding (worst way possible). Anyone else dislikes her?

 

I honestly like her, so far. Sure, she should have killed the creature, but... I don't know. Sometimes it's hard to stick with what you believe in, and I admire her for that, even though I know she's a made up character ._.

 

Put a Spoiler Tag on the thread.

 

Honestly I am okay with her, even though she is uhhhhh... stupid when it comes to fighting. She doesn't understand what is evil, so she thinks that killing a serial killer (yeah that grootslang or that parasite in dark forest) is evil. This is the reason why she isn't chosen (is this the right word?) by Orphion - as she insisted being a dumb pacifist without understanding why this thing has to be killed, at least before she met the Guardian of the forest.

And at last she eventually understood that something have to be killed, it is that being who corrupted Orphion and the realm of light, which is Dern Beast and Bak'al. The storyline is quite interesting imo.

 

I personally do not see it this way, in fact I sympathised with her a lot, but I definitely can see how someone will find her annoying. I just consider it like this: had she not been in this role, she'd probably be a figure revered in the world of wynn akin to Mother Teresa.

 

Rant Incoming​

I don't fucking understand people's problem with Lari. I guess having a character flaw is some sort of fucking warcrime in the eyes of the Wynncraft community. This flaw is meant to enhance the story, and if you don't understand what I mean by that here's this. \/\/\/

"In the creation and criticism of fictional works, a character flaw or heroic flaw is a bias, limitation, imperfection, problem, personality disorder, vice, phobia, prejudice, or deficiency present in a character who may be otherwise very functional. The flaw can be a problem that directly affects the character's actions and abilities, such as a violent temper. Alternatively, it can be a simple foible or personality defect, which affects the character's motives and social interactions, but little else.

Flaws can add complexity, depth and humanity to the characters in a narrative." -people who understand storytelling

A character flaw is a great thing in adding depth and meaning to a character and is a great tool for forming a character arch. Which I also will explain to you because in the world of Wynn such a narrative device is a foreign concept. And I'll also highlight important parts of this lovely wiki segement, written by people that can explain shit way better than I could, so you may get this idea through your silky smooth brain.

"A character arc is the transformation or inner journey of a character over the course of a story. If a story has a character arc, the character begins as one sort of person and gradually transforms into a different sort of person in response to changing developments in the story. Since the change is often substantive and leading from one personality trait to a diametrically opposite trait (for example, from greed to benevolence), the geometric term arc is often used to describe the sweeping change. In most stories, lead characters and protagonists are the characters most likely to experience character arcs, although lesser characters often change as well. A driving element of the plots of many stories is that the main character seems initially unable to overcome opposing forces, possibly because they lack skills or knowledge or resources or friends. To overcome such obstacles, the main character must change, possibly by learning new skills, to arrive at a higher sense of self-awareness or capability. Main characters can achieve such self-awareness by interacting with their environment, by enlisting the help of mentors, by changing their viewpoint, or by some other method."

Incase you still don't understand, Lari's character flaw serves to set up a charcter arc where she learns to abandon her morals for the good of the province. This character development enhances the story by adding more depth and meaning to her character, having this rather than just having one defining trait from other characters so that we can somewhat tell them apart makes her stand out among the other characters of Wynncraft, and also makes the quest much more enjoyable because now we feel like we're going on an adventure with an actual character and not just another NPC. Without this enhancement the story is more dull and some immersion is lost, and this enhancement isn't possible without the character flaw the OP complains about.

Characters are people in a story we're supposed to connect with, and they can make or break a story. Take Star Wars for example, by all acounts the story isn't very interesting on it's own, it's about good vs evil and a big bad opressive government vs a small uprising that stands up for the people. What really makes these movies so great is the characters. Everybody loves Han, Luke, Leia, Darth Vader, C3PO, and R2D2. Now imagine if that story had worse characters in it. Characters without personalities, that are only there to move events forward but don't actaully add anything to the move. Imagine if these movies had fucking Queen Amidala, nobody likes Queen Amidala, she's boring and lifeless and adds nothing to the story. Characters like that would make these classic movies a chore to even sit though.

Now imagine if the characters in Dwarves and Doguns didn't suck. If they had real personalities and weren't generic "Oh opressive people bad, I need to do smth about this." Imagine if they weren't carbon copies of eachother. Name one difference between Axelus and Korzim. *Both Banished from their homes.* Both sons of their peoples' leader.* *Both outcasts trying to convince their people to rise up against their opressors and stand up for what's right.* Imagine these things, and think abiut how much better these quests would be. But there are no character traits flaws or archs so they both just come off as flat, broing and repetetive
so they make the quests much less enjoyable to play.

Now I understand it's hard for Wynncraft characters to be great. Quests have a very limited space to work with when developing characters which is why I don't usually fault them too much when there characters are boring. I mean seriously, it's a video game quest not a full lenght feature film.

But for the devs to introduce a character like Lari and do everything with her that they could and did with this limited workable space is very impressive. And for them to get massively shit on for it because people don't understand the afformentioned narrative devices is super unfair. There are like 2 small issues I have with her arc but I haven't really seen anyone complain about them. And like I said, it's a video game quest not a 2 hour movie. Some various fine details may have to be left behind due to the constraints of the game. So for what it's worth the devs did as perfect of a job as they could, only for it to be met with unfair and uneducated criticism like the original post.

Lari is infinitely better than any Wynn character ever, but people hate her for reasons of "OoOOoH ShE'S StUBboRN AnD It'S ANoYiNG" An actual character trait that makes these quests so much easier to enjoy.

I dunno, I guess Wynncraft has brainwashed it's community with shitty characters like Aledar, Axelus, Tasim, Elphaba, Lucio, Korzim, Draani VIII, Dogun Chief Guy, Elrund, Legolus, Every Elf Ever (except Lari lol), and the nameless gray faces from old Wynn days that they don't know what to do with themselves when they see a real fucking character. A real charcter with real character traits, real character flaws, a real character arch.

Maybe wanting real charcters in my heavily lore driven 5 part quest is an unpopular opinion or something. Apparently wanting the characters I go on epic adventures with to have real personalities and struggles is just for nerds. Fuck me, I guess.

TL;DR Lari is a great character stop being dumb.

 

Batman keeps saying "If you kill a killer, the amount of killers in the world stays the same"
Yes but like, what if you kill 2 killers???? This is your whole job???? These people will kill more people if you let them go????
Not a rant on Lari persay but just a rant on this whole mentality

 

I heavily agree with all you said, and I do wish that more characters were like Lari, but the big problem is how she's portraied.
On the 1st quest she's pacifist. Alright, kinda cliché, but it really does make you think about yourself and how you just murder anything you see in front of you.
2nd quest: here, and on the 3rd quest, we learn about how she has been refusing to fight the creature that is gonna corrupt and decay the land, for a THOUSAND years. She can't put her morals apart; while us, the player, learn to put our morals aside in 30 seconds (when we kill the mayor).
3rd quest: she still doesn't fight the creature, even when Dullahan tells her to do so, and he depends on it to live. Dullahan ends up absorving the hit that Lari would have taken and gets corrupted, this later would cause his death, due to a misinterpretation from the villagers.
Sorry if some of the stuff is inacurate due to my bad memory, but I just want to say that when you actually experience the quests, her character is way worse than how I'm portraying it.
4th quest: alright, Lari is angry that the Player can interact with Orphion but she can't. At first, this is harmless, but when she finds out we were following her (since Orphion commanded us to, although she didnt know that), she snaps and tries to kill us. This is what I call a certified bruh moment. We helped her through so much stuff just for her to pay us back like that.
But when you try to give her a taste of her own medicine and beat her up (sorry if this sounds edgy), the tree spirit suddenly wakes up and interrupts it. There's a brief moment where you think that she's gonna apologize, but no, she snaps again. In the end of the quest all we get is a late sorry, but the actual dialogue makes it sound more like she's trying to forgive herself.
5th quest: NOW she decides to go genocide mode and try and kill bak'al, even jumping on his portal. She also told us to stand back because it would be "dangerous", WHAT DO YOU MEAN! We were going to beat her up on the previous quest, why does she suddenly think she's a goddess that can take on bak'al.
TL:DR since the text is messy:
Lari's character is a good step forward for Wynncraft, but she's PORTRAID as someone who puts her morals in front of everyone else, including friends (except when she wants to beat you up), and never actually does anything good. From the Player's perspective she's incredibly hateable, only making mistakes and being jealous to the point of trying to kill you.

 

The problem isn't her morals and stubbornness, as like I said, those two things are neccesary for her character arc later in the quests. The problem is the limited space of the quest resulting in us never seeing her have any success while still abiding by her morals, we only see her fail. Seeing her fail is, like I said, important to her character arc, however, the lack of success makes the player wonder "well shit Lari, if nothing ever works out for you why keep acting like this?" It's one of the 2 issues I mentioned in my first post but as I said, the space is limited so I think it's forgivable, but I would like to so it changed in the future.

There's also the bad dialouge that makes things seem worse than they actually are, but Wynncraft's bad dialouge is another can of worms, it has always been bad and we all know it. As such this persisting problem isn't a problem with this specific quest or character but does drag it back a bit. However this is par for the course by Wynn standards and isn't deserving of extra critisism.

Overall these 2 issues don't add up to a "bad character" they're just limitations that result in something that can't be perfect. Nothing we haven't seen before here.

The problem isn't the mentality, it's that stupid ass quote. I mentioned above how bad dialouge can make things seem worse that the really are, and this shitstain of a line is a prime example. This dialouge may be stupid but actually understanding the charcter of Batman makes his mentality make a whole lot more sence.

Batman refuses to kill beacuase when he was a kid his world got shattered by a random act of violence, as such he works to make sure that can't happen to anybody else and values all life. Even criminals have families. You can call this a charcter flaw with no resolution, whatever, sure, go ahead, but it was formed by childhood trauma where he litterally watched his parents get shot and murded right infront of him. This is why Batman doesn't use guns and doesn't kill people.

 

If you have all these grand ideas, but limitations prevent you from executing them properly, especially if we're talking about the main character of the most important questline, then I'd say you have failed at creating a good character. I think Lari's pacifist nature is fine and having "flawed characters" is a good thing, but if all the character does is make me not interact with her in the most important questline then I'd rather they hadn't bothered to make a character at all. The only reason I don't hate Lari as much as some other people is the fact that her whole character is funny as hell.

Also saying Lari is a step up from other Wynncraft characters isn't saying much.

 

All this post shows me is that you're lazy and cowardly. Not even fucking bothering to try something your hardest because of adversity and limitations is the epitomy of pathetic. This mentality is the prime example of someone who would take the easy way out because the right way requires an iota of effort. I didn't say Lari was aboslutely perfect, she was a great product considering the skills and workable room of the Devs. If you would rather go back to shit like Tiek and the fucking Heliolux then I guess you're entitled to your own shitty opinions. But don't shit on the people who worked for countless hours on this quest because you have no balls or courage to try shit out of a fear of failure. They'll never improve if they don't try.

Oh wow, so you mean you're tired of the old shit too huh? If you're tired of the old way stop bitching when the new way isn't spotless the first time around.

 

Lmao, you're acting as if I just murdered someone. Just because I don't like the way Lari was handled doesn't mean I don't want the game to improve. You seem to think that I'm "bitching" about the game, just because I don't like your precious little character.

You don't know shit about me. Besides, I'm not the one making the game, so I can be as "lazy and cowardly" as I want to be. You're calling someone "the epitome of pathetic" because of what they said about a fucking Minecraft NPC. Do you seriously think I don't want the CT to try their best? Is that what you see when you read my post? My post was about the quality of the character, which is, in my "shitty opinion" bad, not about worth ethic nor the amount of effort the CT put in. The truth is, the CT bit off more than they could chew and the quality of the update has suffered because of it. Ambition and hard work don't have to be trying to achieve the unachievable. There is just as much (or even more) value in recognising the limitations of your toolset and trying to work your way around them. An elementary schooler doesn't start with quantum physics and an amateur runner doesn't start with the marathon.

I have made a statement about the quality of the product these people have made. I don't like the product. I'm sure they can get over a person not liking the product. I have never "shat" on any of these people. I can't say "oh well I really like your work overall, but there's a few things I would've liked changed" because that's not the way I feel. I say Lari was a mistake, because I think Lari was a mistake. If that's "shitting" on people then so be it. Even if you interpret my post in the worst possible way, I don't see how it's anything more than disappointing or discouraging to hear.

Your post on the other hand is an attack against my character. You have called me lazy, cowardly, pathetic; accused me of being someone who is averse to putting in effort, of having no balls or courage to "try shit". How is this in any way better (and not far worse) than what I've said about you (nothing) or the CT ("your content is bad"). Now I've said some nasty things about people on these forums before, so it would be stupid of me to say that I'm beyond insulting someone like that, nor am I that fazed by your insults.

And since you apparently know exactly what kind of person I am, let me say what I think of you. I think you're a hypocrite who thinks they are above others. You relentlessly attack those who do not agree with you because you think you know better. You mock my being entitled to an opinion, because you do not think that I am. Because my opinion is different from yours, you assume that it is fuelled by malicious intent, but you do not recognise that your posts are far more mean-spirited than mine could ever hope to be.

I do not expect an apology, but I do hope that you see just how hypocritical the statement "don't shit on [people]" is.

 

holy shit relax it's a video game lmao

 

All I'm gonna add to this is that, well, (like I said previously) although I like the direction they took with Lari, they gave us nothing to like about her.
She has nothing that makes us want to root for her as a character, it's actually the opposite. There's a lot to hate about her, and she directly "hurt" the player many times in various ways, which is a big no-no in my book. A character like Lari, or any character at all, shouldn't directly hurt the "viewer" she's trying/supposed to "win over" (from a story telling perspective, of course). She's gonna need a BIG redemption arc to make up for this, which I sadly don't see happening.

 

I completely agree with your first point. Her character is extremely unlikeable, with her entire character being summarized by "dont want to hurt things :(". It's fine for there to be unlikeable characters, however, there should be some sort of relatability or humanization of the character at some point and it just feels like there isn't for Lari. She seems pretty one dimensional and her story arc feels a bit odd,

Spoiler: RoL part 4 spoilers

with her abandoning her values just after we do better than her? For other characters, this might be fine, but there have been plenty of points in the past where it would have made more sense for her to snap like this.

Additionally, we never see Lari get a single win, for her pacifism to pay off a single time. At a certain point it becomes nonsensical for her to continue with this ideal. Final thing: why is she Orphion's chosen? Orphion had thousands of years from the beginning of Lari's failures to find someone else to help, but we are the first and only to be contacted. Orphion is above morals, so I'm sure he would not mind crushing Lari's spirit if it meant getting someone to clean up the decay.

 

I like lari as a whole as she is doing her best to work with the pressure of being the light god's chosen, however she wants to stay pacifistic. My issue is how Orphion is portrayed. You would figure the god of life, light, and goodness you be....peaceful...not
ay u solider fuck. Im sick n need some Niquill, cmer n gimme some bitch. oh yeah kill absolutely everyone in you way, don't hold back, in fact go overboard.
like....he just tells you to kill ppl? isn't that dern's thing.....
Ik hes under the influence of them and is just trying to survive. but he seems more primitive than powerful. Like when I did RoL twice, both times I felt more honorable and good than Orphion/any1 who supports him. I don't hate the story line, I love it alot, #avengedulla
but i still feel like the light isnt...kind...its more degraded.

 

"Isn't that a dern thing?"
YES! :D
That's the point. Light and Dark are basically the same; two sides of the same coin
Light isn't everything good and Dark isn't everything bad
They're just two opposing forces using Wynn as a battleground
Orphion isn't the physical manifestation of everything good, he's the physical manifestation of Light. Orphion's portrayal makes complete and total sense to the entire RoL questline.
He does what needs to be done to maintain balance. Killing isn't just a dern thing.
Also yes Lari is an amazing character. I love the moment she attacks you because I really feel bad for her, she's been trying for 1000 years to no avail and the player comes in and makes her feel like a failure. The moment she snaps and forgets her morals is her character advancing to do what needs to be done. She may seem annoying but she's had her own mistakes and failures for 1000 years run rampant in her head, so it makes sense why she lashes out.

 

huh aight. I read the lore wrong and figured that Light = balance of good and dark = balance of evil, but yeah your point makes it look alot diffrent ty

 

Np :D
Also, if the Light allies itself with the Golem Factory for the greater good, does that mean Dern allies itself with the corruption for the greater good?
What is the greater good for Dern?

 

I really don't think Lari is trying to kill the player out of jealousy, I think she sees the player as a physical reminder of her failures, how she failed to defeat the decay and the player did. When she fought bak'al, this was a pivotal moment in her character, she was out to kill for the greater good, which she didn't do before. She told the player this was her fight because she didn't want her failures to define her, she decided to take fate into her own hands and right her wrongs. I really understand her stubborn cling to pacifism. She spent her entire life finding alternatives to fighting. Lari didn't put her morals above her friends, she thought her morals were what she needed to SAVE her friends. Suddenly she was confronted with the parasite and was asked to kill for the first time in her life. Not killing it was the wrong thing to do, and Lari knows this. She knows Orphion chose wrong, but she did her best anyway. When Dullahan was killed, Lari felt responsible because Dullahan saved her life. She didn't want to let Dullahan die after saving her so she decides to save him by taking him to the Lazurus pit. This eventually perpetuated Lari's deteriorating view of light and reality when Dullahan starts to destroy everything. After 1000 years, after Dullahan falling to the decay because of her, after she lives in the very land she let die, she becomes irrational in a desperate attempt to fix her mistakes. She didn't know what was right anymore; She served Orphion, but he asked her to kill, which conflicted with her morals and what she thought the light was. She became angry with the player because they were the person who reminded her of her failures. She believes Orphion chose her due to her morals and pacifism, so she tries desperately to cling to the last thing she thought she did right. When she tries to kill the player, all of this is built up to her throwing aside her morals and learning the true nature of the Light. It may not make sense that she didn't throw her morals aside right away, but she has been a pacifist for her whole life, and she didn't know what Orphion wanted her to do.

Sorry for my long analysis of Lari's character. :P
TL:DR: Lari is a flawed character and meant to be an unlikable "Rival" from the view of the player, but it's these flaws that make her character very interesting. I think it's very difficult to portray characters in Minecraft, but what the CT have done is absolutely remarkable.

I think many problems people have with Lari stem from people not understanding WHY she acts the way she does, and a lot of it isn't surface level. Many of the details about her character don't come from the base RoL questline. Some of them come from discoveries and/or other quests in the region like Memory Paranoia and I think Iron Heart.