Info The Elemental Revamp: Part 1 - Endgame Overhaul - Updated Changelog Beta 1.1.1

Tempest - dis is spell spam
Anima - dis is spell spam agan
Chaos - spell spam with mana steal but you get 1-shot
Paladin - Animeme but with hp
Void - Tempest + Chaos + a bit of hp - damage = no
Divine - Tank but can get pretty nice damage, actually unique
Rogue - tier stack
Valiance - less tier stack
Vampiric - tier stack downgraded, sometimes hybrid, minus damage plus life steal = timeout in war
Volcanic - Stinger

Hmm, no.

 

It is likely yes, but one would hope the current "meta" gear would still see some use with all the dernic gear, just as currently some specific lower level gear sees alot of use.

The whole point of the idea was to avert the disaster of all our gear getting twisted into something we don't want it to be, feedback is very welcome though.

 

Based on everyone’s thoughts and my own, I’ve compiled this pros/cons list of the update. (If someone already did this don’t bother telling me because I cba to check)

Pros:

• Rainbow Sanctuary and some of the new hive armors are cool...I guess....
• The code changes were nice. Poison deserved that buff
• Some items, like Aries, got additional IDs to make them feel more special and belong to a archetype by adding spell damage

Cons:

• More hive armor was not needed. What made the old hive armor work is that the tri-elemental combos that they had synergized well together. For example, in Boreal-Patterned’s case, water-air-thunder is very common, and in hephaestus-forged’s case, the elements countered each other’s weaknesses. Now, we have hive armors like Obsidian-Framed Crown or whatever it was called, which are just naturally more mediocre due to the archetype they use.
• The last thing we wanted were more mythic boots, since mythic armor is trash compared to weapons anyway.
• Most things got nerfed for no reason and new Blue Mask and Centipede look like joke items
• Mythics got screwed. Either they got nerfed for no reason like Inferno, or suffer from gimmicky bullshit like Nirvana.
• The new item system has been here for 4 years, and for some reason NOW is the time to change everything.
• Most items will go down in price, making it hard for everyone to rebuild their builds
• Unnecessary ids were added to some items. The few people who use Nona use Dondasch with it, but they both have 1+ tier attack speed. Nona is already either very fast or super fast, so who tf cares about the extra attack speed?
• Now that everything has increased sp requirement, buildmaking has less freedom
• And, most of all, this update didn’t fix the two things that were the most broken about the item system: That intelligence was broken and spells are objectively better than melee.

I think we can all agree that the cons heavily outweigh the pros.

 

Seems like this list is made out of a “against” this update view.

________________________________

So your idea is putting a whole new set of reworked items in the game?

 

If you have any more “pros” you’d like to share, or argue against my cons, I’d love to hear them :)

 

Your attitude is quite passive agressive. Just pointing out.

 

Builds become much more diverse, balanced and interesting, items and elements get a more fleshed-out identity, uniques actually serve a purpose, etc. For further explanation and arguments just go through the last 44 pages or even just the original post without ignoring everything that doesn't fit your opinion, I won't repeat all of this.

About the cons:

Didn't you list the new hive armor as a pro (even if it is just a small one) only a few lines before? You don't have to use them if you don't like them, but many other will surely find a good use for them. And if you think these items or the archetypes they relate to are too weak, you can give more exact feedback on this topic, the balancing is obviously not final.

Again: Balancing is not final and if you don't like them, nobody forces you to use them.
This seems to be one of these arguments you only put in to make the con-list appear longer.

Of course an overhaul like this requires many nerfs and also buffs (which will easily get overlooked as people tend to focus on the negative). And you can be sure that things didn't get nerfed for no reason, just because the Item Team enjoys destroying items. If you have questions about specific items, you can ask them, most of the time, there will be a lot of thoughts behind it which arent directly obvious.
About the two items you named: One of the main goals of this update is to make skill points actually matter and with this in mind, a lvl 68 item easily providing you with 80+ sp is just absolutely broken. And the +2 attack speed of Centipede is a huge damage boost and along with the melee damage and walk speed, it should come with some serious drawbacks (and no, not being able to use spells isn't that much of a drawback if you were going for full-melee tierstack anyway). Plus, you have to consider its only lvl. 80, so it should be a bit weaker than most other endgame items.
And again: Balancing is not final.

Saying that "Mythics got screwed" is a huge overstatement and although I might repeat myself: Balancing is not final, if certain mythics end up being to weak, they will be buffed. And no, if items actually get an identity, it doesn't automatically make them "bullshit".

Because the old system was very flawed and it takes a lot of time to understand it and how to solve its problems. Remember, this is not done by professionals, but by people working on it in their free time and even the Item Team itself is a relative new addition, as far as I know, Selvut was basically managing it all alone before.
Besides that, this is not even an argument for any side. The fact that the system gets changed now isn't good or bad just by itself, what matters are the positive or negative impacts of this change, which we discuss in other arguments.

Yes, thats a problem and I can understand why people are mad because of this. But I'm sure that it won't take too long to get a new build, especially if you prepare for the update. Its not like all items you have suddenly become useless just because one or two new ids only get average rolls and getting a few new items shouldn't be too hard if you remember that you don't have to create a perfect, maxed-out build within the first day. Overall, this is only a short-tem problem and in my opinion, the long-term benefit of having a much better build-system definitely outweighs it.

Just because something doesn't make sense in old builds, it doesn't mean its useless in new builds. Don't judge a new system based on an old meta (which also relates to the "problem" of items seem to be getting nerfed: just because they don't work within the old boundaries, it doesn't mean they became worse).

Yes, you will have less freedom, less choices available, but on the other hand, these choices become much more meaningful. Limitations create problems, which require creative solutions to overcome, items that actually serve a purpose other than just being strong. Being able to slap together whatever you want might be freedom, but its far from being creative or interesting. Again, this topic has already been discussed a lot, if you look through previous pages.

While these issues might be addressed through further balancing, I would agree that even with this update, Wynncrafts build and combat system is flawed and would probably require new mechanics like additional spells or ids to become really good. But even if its not perfect, its still a huge step forward, melee and tank playstyles have definitely been improved and overall, the item team did the best they could do within the limitations of current mechanics.

Nobody stops you from giving your own feedback, but calling this pro/con list "Based on everyone’s thoughts" and saying that "I think we can all agree that the cons heavily outweigh the pros." are very bold statements.

 

- Anima - has about equal split between mr/ms, you can go either way.
- Chaos - gets a massive amount of damage. You can use random rares and uniques with Chaos, and outdamage non-Chaos mythics. If you have the skill/luck to make it work it can be quite nice.
- Paladin - more like Tempest with hp
- Void - yeah I don't really like this one either.
- Valiance is raw melee, and does that well
- Volcanic, yeah it's 90% Stinger (the main reason this archetype is viable at all) and 10% glassier higher dmg raw melee (see: Agitation)

 

valiance hero best hero...

 

WFA Hero is coolest reeee

But yeah, that fits into my description - glassier, higher dmg for ETF+A Hero as compared to EFA Hero.

 

I mean there are only so many ways you can get good damage lol

Tierstack
Rawstack
Big melee
Spell spam
Big spell (kinda doesnt exist except like one build rn, and probably never will)
Poison
Tank...(???)
Hybrid...(???)

And thats less than 10 kinds of builds that basically any competitive build will slot into lol

I guess you can make distinctions (agi vs def tank, dex vs str dmg, etc) but in the end its all the same

 

Wdym EWAT hero is the best hero. Quad element!

 

This is going to destroy every build mainly because of the insane skill requirement increase on almost all changed items

you're lucky crafted users.... im a bad build maker and im gonna have to rework my entire build... Volcanic? haha... i cant beat wybel before this... after, i'll have to take off most of my armor and accessories to even be able to use my bow...

 

hey this has quieted down

 

it's all so tiresome

 

Why is Discord IGN required to submit a feedback form? That's kind of annoying me.

 

This looks too complicated, just gonna play w/ common gear and end with brilliant diamond

- on my way to get a full set rn

 

would it be possible to remove the catalyst requirement for refunding hive items with this update? i don't think most people have the foresight to grind out 10 of each boss to trade their changed items in after the update, and trying to do Qira when your build was just destroyed isn't gonna be easy.

Infact while we're at it, i'd like to ask why the requirements to do the bosses 2-3 times over just to trade your item in to something else is there in the first place.

 

http://prntscr.com/ohq2c7
Why is Suppression so weak now? :(

 

lmfao unspeakable needs a nerf yea