SPOILER Items Id Rounding Changes - Foreseeable Impacts On Build Making And Game Balancing

Originally I was gonna type an essay on this topic, but then I remembered I do actually have a 6-page research report due tomorrow 4pm, so I'm just gonna keep it tl;dr friendly and skip most of the analysis part to the result part.

The topic of discussion is regarding the changes in ID rounding system Selvut posted not long ago, and this thread will focus on items with a base value of 1.


Most significant changes

• Base value of 1/4 Mana Regen/Steal items will only be 1/4 [currently 30% chance for 2/4] e.g. Stardust, Concentration, Summa, Raindrop, Capricorn, Freedom
• Base value of +1 Tier Attack Speed items will only be +1 [currently 30% of +2] e.g. all Identifiable attack speed increase items like CoI, Burnout, Leggings of Haste,

Impacts on Game Balancing

• Build making is restricted to making "One Trick" builds, in a game that is such emphasis on mana cost, items with small mana regen especially accessories are valuable to make even non intel builds have a bit of sufficient mana to be decent. After this change, every non-intel build will suffer tremendously, due to the above-mentioned items no longer able to have 2/4 mana regen. Think about it. This game EMPHASIS on using spells, as melee is deemed "too op" and what not (lets not turn this thread into a melee build discussion), if you're just using a thunder spell build, or just about any non-water builds, you will have much less mana than before, and its not like there was a lot of small mana regen items to choose from to begin with.

• Passive but major buff in Intel Builds meta, Intel builds / water builds is passively buffed, as most intel builds utilise items with a lot of mana regen, thus this base value of 1 change do not affect those. Compare to other builds, they have a significant mana advantage, doubling or tripling the amount of mana regen they can have compare to other builds

• Passive raise of rainbow tank meta, currently, most builds have a few rainbow elements on it just to keep the elemental defence positive. As more "balanced" builds are impossible due to lack of mana and forced to become "One-Trick" focused, more people would rather choose to abandon being "One-Tricking" and go for rainbow tank instead. In fact, this situation is already happening as the term "rainbow slap" can be seen everywhere, however, this phenomenon will most likely severely increase after the "nerf" on 1/4 mana items.

• Melee builds are irrelevant, in a game with like 4000 items, only less than 10 items give attack speed increase, this says a lot about "how the developers want us to play the game". Whether its OP or not is not discussed here, but what I am saying is, with +2 tier items restricted to only Centipede, melee builds are majorly nerfed to a point where its not worth using, especially considering said melee mythics are at risk of being nerfed for the same reason after the mythic balancing update. Melee items itself have a lot of major design problem including forcing the player to be glass cannon in exchange for damage and what not, further (passively) nerfing it just kills any opportunity of diverse playstyle that wynn is oh so proud of. [THIS POST IS NOT A DISCUSSION FOR MELEE BUILDS BEING OP OR NOT]

• Market prices fluctuation, honestly, wynncraft's economy is extremely unstable, so this is just another icing on the cake, nuf said. This instability of economy is due to the fact that items value does not change by itself like many normal markets does, but instead is changed by developers making spec changes on them. In other games, this tactic is used by developers to force a change in meta to keep the game from becoming stagnent and attract more players. But in wynn, these changes only infuriate the dedicated marketers and most experienced players that contribute to the majority of this vibrant community. [THIS POST IS NOT A DISCUSSION FOR BROKEN ECONOMY]

How to Save?
This change to the ID system *maybe* unintentional due to fixing the infamous SP glitch...? (i think), so direct revert to the system might not be possible, however there are some ideas that should fix or ease the current situation, especially considering the high amount of community backlash on this change

• ADD MORE OPTIONS, especially pre-id 2/4 or +2 tier items as identifiable base 2 value items will give a 10% chance of 3/4 or +3, more options in these territory would be nice
• Lower SP requirements on some items, counter-intuitive to what Selvut has been doing to the past month, however this is a possible solution to save some of the balanced or hybrid elements in build making, which the community wants.
• Increase base mana regen

There, I've highlighted the major impact this change will do to the build making community and the market community, which honestly are the only thing end game players enjoy to do. Please leave [CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM] and more ideas if you think of one, and please have a [LOGICAL DISCUSSION]

I might add more of my ideas if I think of some later on, but I think the ones listed are the most significant impact. (if only i can add this 903 words to my actual report)

 

i agree

 

Am worried about my 2/4 Pre-Nerf Concentration....
Am worried about remaining 2/4 Concentrations selling for stacks on stacks. :(

 

tl;dr of tl;dr pls

 

I thought they would all be fixed?

 

Appearently this was always intended, and how items were balanced, we will have to see

 

Think of it this way: Most of the balance changes in the update were built around the ID rounding changes, fixing any unnecessary "nerfs" to items. I could be wrong, but it's a possibility. (To me at least...)

 

*sees what build meta buff*
THATS ALL I CARE ABOUT

 

they would all be 1/4 even the existing ones, thats my point

ik, thats the "how developers want us to play the game" vs "how the community actually plays the game" argument, im just summarising facts here ideology like these are unchangeable sadly

 

If it was, then why report on it as completely separate? It's more likely this IS what the devs originally intended.
Also,

considering how much everything else has been fixed, I'd say that it's possible that Selvut has done some major endgame reworking in order to accommodate for this major change. For example, we already know that he's buffed Galleon as a result.

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I'm kind of confused as to why that's a bad thing considering that Concentration is a level 8 ring that for some reason sells for more than pretty much every other ring in the game.

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Or maybe just give everyone more base mana regen, so that intelligence is not needed as much and mana regen isn't as much of a powerhouse as it is now.

 

My question is what mythics to sell and what to keep.

 

Honestly, none of the mythics are really affected by this. Maybe Freedom and Boreal, but the rest are largely unaffected

 

People don't seem to realize how strong Attack Tier is, seeing as it compounds the melee damage buffs you receive. It's not the only way to make a melee build, it was just always the strongest due to the potential of +2 tier.

 

+2 tier can well be paired with a significant amount of -melee dmg if you feel like increasing the amount of melee build options, but no way you havent thought of that already, so it comes down to the executive decision of developers that decided not to make melee builds a viable gameplay option.

+damage on normal melee items without attack speed increase currently doesnt compensate the lost of dps when compare to usage of +attack speed items

tbf if melee build is such op in gm's mind then this change might well fix this "abusiveness" of melee builds, but i think most would agree more +1 tier options or melee-centric items with better (not even better, just normal) survivability and easier accessibility (lower sp req) for more level ranges would benefit the game

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idk really thats what i heard, maybe becoz they put the two announcement tgt so that lead me to think of it that way, but is it really important tho?

maybe, we're all in the stage of speculations here, it is quite possible the id change will hit live server before item balance update

lack of options: thats the main reason, concentration was in meta because of no sp requirement for easy mana regen, which most builds need to u know, operate. after they added summa and nerfed concentration the abuse of this item have eased a lot. and now since every id-able ring are either gonna be 1/4 or (if they add or change new ids in the future) have the potential to be 3/4 (due to 2 x 1.3 = 2.6 -> 3) and probably comes with significant limitation, the utility mana accessories will never be the same

very good idea, i'll add it tho it seemed like some decision thats not easily implemented by item gms and wt not

 

One thing that won't be affected is Cancer-Taurus, as Cancer's base value is 10, Taurus being -20 meaning their values are solid. If you use a super fast weapon with + attack tier (diamond static necklace is a good option) you can make the full use of the raw melee. Also with the recent poison fix, that combo can do even more damage since poison is always working. People are saying that Cancer is being nerfed, but it shouldn't affect this since it is based on raw melee and not % melee.
Long story short: we still have viable melee builds dont go and have an aneurysm quite yet

 

Are people still triggered to death by Cancer-Taurus?

 

Except there are still items that work to fill the role; Suppression, Moon Pool, Coral Ring and Myrrh will all see more use instead of Concentration, and Summa, while hit, will still see use. The niches that Concentration covered will now be open for new items to fill, and though they won't be as good as the old Concentration, the entire point of this was making sure that Concentration is no longer so brokenly powerful.

also, it is possible that they might see a buff; I'd argue that Concentration might have gotten one if the old Concentration weren't on the market. Again, we're speculating on a math change alone without much basis otherwise, so this could all be for naught


I still want to see an increase in base mana regen though.

Yeah; if it was intentional then it will not be reverted. If not, it will be reverted.

 

Not anymore since Taurus was nerfed a while ago. People don't consider it a viable build, except for me.
i make strangely viable builds

 

Wt I meant by intentional or not is like, if its unintentional but its necessary to patch the sp glitch, would that be worth it for the community to adapt to it? That's up to debate

After the 1/4 thingie become updated, only existing rings with 2/4+ mana regen would be either suppression or moon pool, either have their downside as one hv -ms and the other hv high intel req, so for the niche of "2/4 mana regen rings with low or no sp requirement so more builds can use" there would be currently none, there might come a day where update introduces some items that fill in this niche, or they do indeed receive a buff in some way, i guess we just have to wait and see

Increase in base mana regen would be very crucial to solving a lot of problem not just this change really, a very good suggestion that i havnt thought of before. I do remember seeing one of Igbar's old video saying salted insist mana being a important limiting factor (oh the irony).

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true, my hindsight in didnt factor in other types of melee builds, you do have a point.

build options for these types of melee builds are still limited tho

 

Water is cool and good. Melee sucks