Join The Epic Debate Of Whether Idol Or Tide Is Better

Tide or Idol?

Backgroud: I had an auction in trade market with this tidebinder but then it turned into an epic debate about tide and idol! now it shall continue!

Spoiler: auction in the past

Max Mana Regen
Max Water Defence
Max Intel
-1 Max Fire Defence
-1 Max Agility

Start Bid: 12LE
Min Bid Inc: 1LE
Buyout: 32LE
End Time: Poll

Lead: 12

- Can only win bid if more than one bid is bidded
- Auction extend for 4 hours if anyone bid in last 2 hours

 

rip spell dmg.
imo most important stats are mana > spell dmg > intel

 

imo tidebinder is shit for damage anyways so its best for using it in defensive builds
and this one got god defence

 

tidebinder literally outdamages Idol, and gives 1/4s more mr.
Spell is important.
This is worth ~18-22le.

 

Ummmm.
Idol has over 30% more base damage than Tidebinder. Its damage is also more stabile.

Tidebinder does not outdamage Idol.

 

@JaydonTheWarrior
literally tested this
with screenshots.

One sec let me dig them up.

________________________________

tidebinder:


idol:


Same exact build, both uppercut.

 

Powders on both?
I remember @Stag2001 doing the calcs and he got considerably more damage from Idol. Interesting.

 

both full t6 water powder.

 

Also you have to remember Idol has that invisible raw spell damage on it.

Well, let's see. The spell damage multiplier for normal attack speed is 2, for slow it is around 1.4.

Idol's base damage is 2×310~360=620~720.
Tidebinder's base damage is 1.4×285~425=399~595.

If we consider the spell damage, Tidebinder outdamages Idol when it gets an almost max roll while Idol gets an almost minimum roll. And Idol has that invisible ~300 damage on the uppercut hit.

Tidebinder does not outdamage Idol. That pic is rigged, he apparently chose Idol's bad roll and Tidebinder's almost max roll. Or then I derped with the spell multiplier numbers.

 

No, these were the average numbers. Idol averaged ~4500
Tide average ~4800

The ranges were something like
Idol 4200-4900
tide 3900-5800

________________________________

sorry my bad
as quoted from discord
4000-5000 with idol
3500-6000 with tide
Idol is more consistent, but tide has better overall damage.
Don't forget the extra 1/4s mr too, thats pretty important.

 

The absolute base damages on both weapons make it hard for me to believe. I don't think %spell damage is quite that significant when calculating damage.

But yeah also I think it is an important stat on Tidebinder. I believe that was your main point after all?

 

Stop spreading shit.

 

I'm making a thread about mythic substitutes and comparing them.

 

@JaydonTheWarrior

 

let's do maths here
by the almighty calculator of motoki
we have damage of first hit on upper
both with builds on 120 int and 0% spell and 0 Raw spell

TideBinder (26% spell 13int) [3 T6]
1965-4315
average 3140
Idol (20int 300 raw spell) [3 T6]
3150-5288
average 4219

Spoiler: Oh boy.....

I mean if you take the maximum dmg of Tide and take minimum of Idol
ofcuz Idol would do less dmg

 

Yeah but when you think about the fact that really good tidebinder isn't worth much and even a bad idol costs quite alot then tidebinder is definitely good for its price/performance ratio.

 

BOI learn something call

Spoiler

MYTHIC ITEM[5]
worth it 5 ReID kappa
rip dark theme btw
and I PAY CUZ IT'S MYTHIC

 

Addressing these, tide binder does more over all dmg. It's min was lower however it's mad was higher, the best number I got from tide was 6500 idol was 6000, both had full water powders.
also spell dmg raw is just a number added on the end of each hit, if you honestly think that doing another 325 dmg per upper really matters then good on you.
As for spell % if you honestly think it doesn't mater much then.... Wait how do you think this.
Anyways you can believe idol is better then tide binder if you want, but having both I find idol kinda disappointing at best.

 

That is interesting, because you cannot ignore this fact: Idol has way more base damage than Tidebinder. The pics you provide simply do not convince me, as @JackyKit did the calculations using motoki's calculator, and got the following results:

To me your pics look exactly like you took the lowest damage uppercut from Idol and the highest damaging one from Tidebinder. I cannot prove anything, but at least the results @JackyKit got are the ones supposed to happen. If it is different for you, there is a bug in the damage formula that causes you to get wrong test results in practise.

Yes, this is very true. Tidebinder is meant to be the close-in-performance budget Idol. But it does not, by any formula or any rational way of thinking, have more damage than Idol.

 

Then again, y'all are free to test for yourselves. I had jaydon test like 10 uppercuts, so its not a small sample size for its purpose.
Feel free to collect your own data.
From our data, Tide > Idol.

@SilverMirror must be enjoying the free bumps.