Serious Riots/protests Across The Country

Yep, opposites, just like Heads and Tails. Two sides of the same coin.

 

K

 

Shall I explain why?

 

No. He believed in aliens, any argument is invalid

(This is a joke, because I just remembered that sarcasm is hard to get across in the internet)

 

@IllusionarySpy already wrecked this cuck but i'll do it again:

sounds like this is gonna be a fair and unbiased argument

yes, because beating the crap out of trump supporters, starting fires, and rioting is totally a reasonable way to show that you don't support somebody.

fair point.

i know you're an edgelord, but trump isn't a dictator. do you even know what "dictator" means?
a ruler with total power over a country, (not true, congress also exists)
typically one who has obtained power by force. (not true, won the election, and don't give me crap about "hurr durr shillary won popular vote durr")

>implying communism/socialism could work
>being this edgy

and this is bad why? it's not a bad thing to want to put america first.

i'm going to assume you're talking about the border wall, which isn't racist. putting up a border wall is like letting guests into your house; you could either see who you can trust to let into your house, or take off all the doors and end up letting in people you might not normally want in your house.
even if you're not talking about the wall, he hasn't done anything racist in office yet. before you say "durr travel ban is racist", when japan decides not to let in refugees, nobody bats an eye, but when america decides not to let in refugees, everybody loses their shit?

non-violent protests are a thing, you know. (not that they got anything done, but these protests won't either)

and they are being dealt with, because they ARE a problem.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
THAT'S FUNNY
YOU THINK PROTESTING WILL ACTUALLY MAKE THAT HAPPEN
LOL NO, QUIT BEING DELUSIONAL

defend != not wanting to set a precedent that "anyone i think is a nazi/anyone i don't like gets punched"

except that they ARE. just because you disagree with them doesn't mean they can't say it.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." -Evelyn Beatrice Hall

define "certain opinions". once we set a precedent that "these people can be punched for what they say", that precedent will get closer and closer to "anyone i don't like gets punched for what they say".

UH OH LOOK OUT, IT'S THE SPOOKY SCARY ALT-RIGHT
"alt-right" is just an empty buzzword used by cucks like you to accuse anyone you don't like of being a "nazi" without saying the word "nazi".
also, you do realize that just because you disagree with them, that doesn't mean they can't exist as a party, right?
then again, you're a fan of thought police.

not a liberal, nice job assuming things though
also, once again, defend != not wanting to set a precedent that "anyone i think is a nazi/anyone i don't like gets punched". get that through your thick skull.

while they do believe similar things to the nazis, we still shouldn't punch them.

>ctrl+f "hitler"
>0 results
also, just because he "plans on being hitler", that doesn't mean he will be. seriously, there's no fucking way any sort of neo-nazi movement could be anything like it was in WWII today.

bitch, "free speech" is being able to freely express your opinion. if they actually DO racist things and commit violence against other people, that's another story, but they're just opinions.

opinion: n. a view, judgment, or appraisal formed in the mind about a particular matter.
they're still opinions, and even if you don't like them, that doesn't mean the people forming those opinions should be punched, because again, if we punch people for racist opinions, what else can we punch them for?

free speech != defending racists

QED.
delete your account and never post again.

 

Which is completely fine in my books, as the TPP was being negociated in secret, would allow terrible power relations between employer and employees, and is basically a giant fuck you to the consumer and is a big corporations' wet dream. (copyright rights shrinking, anti environnemental concerns, ect). One of the very very few things Trump has done that was actually important.
Fuck the Obama administration for legislating such a fucking bullshit trade agreement.

Basically my point when responding to @Zacmo

 

Here's my point of view.
In an administration that's willing to blatantly lie (for example, as Dan Van Winkle of themarysue.com put together,

• Spicer complaining that the white tarps to protect the grass created an optical illusion that made the empty spots stick out more compared to photos of Obama’s inauguration. That’s some straight up Men in Black neuralyzer, “it was just swamp gas reflecting off a weather balloon” bullshit, but even worse than Agent Jay’s attempt.
• A bizarre insistence that Trump’s was the largest crowd ever to witness an inauguration, “period.” That’s … just not true, and it’s deeply unsettling to see a White House official, in an official capacity, try to “fact check” reporting with blatant lies.
• Spicer’s agitation and the fact that he didn’t take a single question, especially when reporters shouted to ask how he could say it was the largest inauguration when he’d justsaid it was impossible to know hard numbers.
• A claim that Trump’s chat with the CIA was a massive success, when reports suggest that, as usual, audible signs of support were coming from Trump staffers or supporters, not the CIA (further information suggests this is true, and that attending CIA officials did not view the event favorably, though some Trump-supporting CIA staff was likely in attendance), as Trump railed against the media and pledged to have the back of the intelligence community he’s attacked on Twitter.
• The claim that we can’t know how many protestors there are, in a blatant attempt to undercut any stories that there were more protestors than inaugural attendees, without having to actually say that, because even they know that would go too far. That’s disgusting.)

, protest is one of the only ways to send a message to people in the government. Protests are the only thing we have atm, and we have that right reserved to us under the 1st amendment.

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Also, I love how you out the tags "Conservatives" and "liberals", despite the fact that a lot of us don't try and slap a label on ourselves. I'm not a liberal. I am left wing, but that doesn't make me a part of a political party or ideology.

 

Haha holy fuck. "Be tolerant of other views" is the main point in this argument - yet I've just been called a 'cuck'

"Implying communsim could work" - ok. Firstly - since when did capitalism work either, where I live migrant workers have no rights, their pay is often withheld for months, they earn 1 euro an hour when they do make money, while those who exploit those workers live in a tropical paradise. It may be easier to criticise communism for its failings in the past - as a result of the rulers not the system may I add, but if you think a bit and take a look around you can see just how many more lives capitalism affects negatively. That phone/PC you use to so cockily type your reply uses resources mined by an underpaid worker somewhere hot, you have no right to defend capitalism when you are the one benefitting from it.

And of course - putting america first may sound like a good idea at first, but this is the era of globalisation. Trump wants to bring factories back to America instead of China, does he not understand how outsorcing is the basis of late stage capitalism, his nationalism is going to be nothing but harmful to america.

When I sais mildly racist its kind of presumed knowledge that you've heard his racist remarks. Such as him saying that Mexico are "sending rapists and drug dealers" or something along those lines. Also may I point out that Japan has had immigration restricitons for everyone for a long time - not just refugees. Whereas the US's travel ban clearly targeted at certain groups and even if slightly sensible has been sloppily carried out.

So your next point shows you have little political knowledge and are just jumping on the bandwagon. "non-violent protests are a thing, you know. (not that they got anything done" - seriously? Never got amything done in the history of man?. Yeah, nothing, aside from being highly successful in the civil rights movement in America, successful in freeing India led by Ghandi. My apologies if I misunderstood you there, but if not - holy fuck. I don't care if the protests are violent or non-violent, something has to be done - do you expect people to idly sit by and tell Trump on twitter to "please stop" while he fucks their countrys reputation.

Ah and here's an insult - not that I haven't slung a few in anger admitedly, but at least I had some taste instead of sounding like a 12 year old who just found the caps lock key.

".defend != not wanting to set a precedent that "anyone i think is a nazi/anyone i don't like gets punched"".... but trying to stop people from being punched is defending someone...

Sure, but some 'views' are just factually incorrect. Racism being an easy example. So will this Evelyn chick defend a KKK member believing all blacks should die?

Your next point is a lazy excuse of one - if "we let the alt-right exist we set a precedent that racism is A OK in this society" is a point I can make as well with that exact same reasoning.

Wew im a cuck again - nice. At this point you are defending the alt right so your previous point about "defend != not being ok with a precedent of punching Nazis" is invalid. And yes , theyre scary. Are you the subject of their racism? Don't you think that if you were not white you might be a tad bit scared that racists are allowed to exist as a party? A slightly less extreme and legalised KKK certaintly is scary. And what do you mean about it being an empty buzzword to avoid saying Nazi, my point you were quoting was that they arent "alt right", theyre Nazis, theyre the ones trying to hide from being Nazis not me lol. And when did I say I'm a fan of thought police? These people are voicing their unacceptable views, if theyre going to keep it to themselves thats fine - but as soon as those views are voiced it becomes a lot more harmful, as I said earlier, scary.

I wasnt talking to you lol. Youre taking personal offence from a statement directed at someone else? Looks like someones desperate for points.

Holy fuck again. I cant even take you seriouslt at this point, your idea of reading an article is control F? The article makes comparisons to Nazi Germany in the terms used and such. 'Hitler' need not be said for a comparison to be drawn.

Again, holy fuck. Using your definition of 'opinion' - racism is not an opinion. You bamboozled yourself here, racism is not a 'matter' - racism is when someone tries to dispute basic facts, there is no ethical or moral argument, therefore it is not an opinion, bamboozled yourself lad.

So in the end you debunked your own argument, nice.

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If i put a picture of Nixon or Bush instead would you still call me out on my supposed hypocrisy, because y'know, the US is well known to intervene as they like, propping up facist governments in countrys that faced the supposed 'threat' of communism. The US's intervention has gotten many killed and led to many problems. I won't dispute that stalin was at times a horrible person, but so were many of the US leaders.

 

for the record, using the QUOTE tag would be nice on formatting.

yeah you got me there

okay, go on

okay

alright hold up
yes, this PC does use silicon and other resources mined in fuck-knows-where.
why can't i defend capitalism because i benefit from it? that'd be one of the main reasons to defend it. the fact that i can benefit from it would be a start; who on earth has benefitted from other systems like communism/socialism other than the rulers of those systems? that's a serious question, 'cause as far as i know, the answer is "very few people, if any."

bringing factories back to america would decrease shipping costs (as we wouldn't have to ship a bunch of shit back and forth), increase the quality of the products being made (american-made goods are generally higher quality than china-made goods), and would bring more manufacturing jobs back to america.

i did, but i assumed you meant the larger things and policies like the wall and the travel ban.

well, some of them are:
https://apnews.com/0a51c183539c4e8e9f8737cd9f658f81
http://abc7news.com/news/san-francisco-pier-14-shooting-suspect-deported-5-times/826423/
http://abc7.com/politics/la-father-...by-man-in-us-illegally-speaks-at-rnc/1432675/
http://www.cbs5az.com/story/27911249/suspect-caught-in-deadly-mesa-store-shooting
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...Kayla-Gomez-Orozco-arraigned-Tyler-Texas.html
i could go on and on, but you get the point.

briefly sloppily carried out before some screwball judge in the 9th circuit blocked it, a judge who also previously declared "black lives matter" in a hearing:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/aug/17/james-robart-federal-judge-declares-black-lives-ma/

okay, really weak argument from me. i did mean "not that they get anything done" in that it seemed like it wouldn't be as effective in sending a message (although i seem to have said "got anything done" as a typo), but now that i've looked further into it, it seems like the opposite is true. my bad.

pretty much; gets harder to stay reasonable when one side seemed pretty orwellian in what they were saying.

defending someone, but not defending their views.

yes, racist beliefs are often based on things that are factually incorrect, i won't deny that.
don't know who evelyn is

the difference is that the alt-right won't make it very far past racist beliefs, since society has been through that before and won't let it happen again.
however, it has been shown that people are willing to and already have punched people for being a neo-nazi, or just a trump supporter minding their own business.

not terribly, but go on

no, and probably.

with just as much power; that is to say, no power at all. the KKK isn't even a thing anymore like they used to be. they've only got 5,000 people left, and haven't done anything on the scale of what they used to do. the alt-right isn't really that scary either, for similar reasons. harder to find exactly what they've done when it's primarily far-left, really biased news sources spouting the term "alt-right" all over the place.

i know you weren't, you still made assumptions about who you WERE talking to

i read the article as well, but seriously, richard spencer and his team of edgelords aren't gonna become the new nazi germany.
also, back to the "trump has said some racist things before", here's the end of the article as a counter-point:
"President-elect Trump has continued to denounce racism of any kind and he was elected because he will be a leader for every American," Mr Trump's transition spokesman Bryan Lanza said in a statement.
"To think otherwise is a complete misrepresentation of the movement that united Americans from all backgrounds."

it IS an opinion, albeit a misguided and factually incorrect one. it may not be a "matter" but it's still an opinion about certain race(s) of people.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

 

It was Shrek all along.

Appeal to emotion. We shouldn't give a shit if certain people think people having disgusting opinion is "scary", this is an unacceptable excuse for silencing others.

Seems like you like the idea of policing and organizing what idea is worth saying or not.

Like the US has a Racist Party™ or something. That's how fringe neo nazis are, dude, the closest thing you can call "nazis" is the alt-right movement, a nebulous conglomerate of people holding different ideas, born from a counter culture.

​

He almost has the silver play button

 

@memethyl "who on earth has benefitted from other systems like communism/socialism other than the rulers of those systems" - sure, that's been very true in such cases as the USSR I agree. However that wasn't pure communism, if communism was carried out correctly it wouldn't just be the rulers benefitting. However capitalism is not some excellent system that had beeb sullied by the leaders of the world, capitalism is inherently unfair - the very basis of capitalism is the exploitation of workers, that won't change.

"bringing factories back to america would decrease shipping costs (as we wouldn't have to ship a bunch of shit back and forth), increase the quality of the products being made (american-made goods are generally higher quality than china-made goods), and would bring more manufacturing jobs back to america." A) It has become increasingly easy and cheap to trasnsport goods and nowadays it really isn't such a significant factor im factory placement. B) Generally higher quality? Could you give an example? Apple products are some of the highest quality PC's around, with a consistent smooth design, Apple products are made in China. Unless we're talking handmade goods there really isn't going to be a difference in quality because so much of the manufacturing process is mechanised. C) Sure, it would bring manudacturing jobs back to America, but why would you want that? There's so many reasons against it. Firstly America doesn't need more manufacturing jobs, they are low skill jobs characteristic of mid and low income countrys. Secondly American workers are at least 10 times more expensive than Chinese workers, Chinese workers can be paid as low as 40 or so cents an hour(and due to dismal workers rights you can get away with sometimes not paying them at all!) whereas in America workers have decent rights and get paid at minimum 11$/hr(do correct if that's wrong but I know its a lot better than what the Chinese workers get). Worker's pay is as always the key factor, and with such a great difference the change in shipping cost makes no difference.

You keep trying to defend them from being called alt-right, that's literally what they call themselves - who are you defending? Also "harder to find exactly what they've done when it's primarily far-left", umm no. Please don't tell me you think the Nazis were actually far left. The left is mostly based around the idea of equality, the alt right does not want to treat everyone equally, case closed. (The leader also supports Donald Trump, and Trump is not left wing at all).

" judge who also previously declared "black lives matter" in a hearing" - i don't personally support the movement either, but supporting it makes the judge a 'screwball'? I thought you were defending peoples right to belive and say whatever.

Made asumptions about who I was talking to? I was literally quoting the dude, I'm not saying my reply wasn't open to debate from others, but to take personal offence when I was most clearly quoting illusional is still silly.

So Trump hasn't denounced racism himself? Just his spokesman who wants to give Trump a better image. His racist remarks will stay and show that he is a racist until he acknowledges they were wrong statements to make and makes a sincere apology.

But your dictionary definition said an opinion is about a "particular matter" so you just supported my point by agreeing that racism is not a matter.

Also "Seems like you like the idea of policing and organizing what idea is worth saying or not" - I just don't think blatant lies (racism) should be acceptable in a democratic system.

 

disclaimer: i'm not a communist i'm a socio-capitalist. just thought that i'd be associated with a special someone else on this thread.

also, no one really responded to my thread. that makes me kinda sad.

 

Two contradictions, nice. "Left wing" - is capitalist. Not a "part of a ... ideology" - states ideology to be socio-capitalism.

 

I will slap you.

I'm not a socio-capitalist for the sake of an idea, I'm a socio-capitalist because it seems to be better than any other system, as we can see with many nations across the globe. And being "left wing" doesn't make you a fucking communist, it means you uphold egalitarian views, wether that be for ideals or because it's the least arbitrary system. Being left-wing is not an economic philosophy, dumbass. Also, I'm not a straight up capitalist. Nice strawman. I'd rather eat my own left elbow than live in a system with straight capitalism. However, nothing is black and white. Just because I disagree with you doesn't make me the complete opposite of you.

 

Let's be honest here, those jobs are LOST. We have robots now, and they don't need to be payed $10 an hour.

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Why is that trademarked?

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Don't be silly, we already have the internet for that.

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I am so tempted to add that to my signature somewhere

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You underestimate the stupidity of humanity.

 

Most censorship I've seen in my life has come to die on the internet, I don't know what websites you visit, but the internet is a ruthless free speech zone, and should remain that way.

 

-waits for a reply to me some more because I live on debate-

 

O-oh okay.

You're wrong.
Hope that helps

 

it didn't

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It was this one that no one responded to and it made me really sad because I spent a small amount of time on it

 

Haha you're joking right? Popular social media websites are all filled with censorship. The internet is the ideal place for censorship, in real society it's a lot harder to stop someone sharing their ideas, on the internet it's as simple as clicking delete.

Let's take one large social media site, Reddit. One of the creators of the site was recently involved in editing user's comments on r/The_Donald (a pro donald trump section of the forum), further than that he edited user's comments which insulted him saying "Fuck u/Spez (the creator involved in this incident)" to "Fuck *insert r/The_Donald admin here*". If editing what people have said aint a violation of this precious "free speech" i don't know what is.

Reddit, which claims to be the frontpage of the internet is indeed ripe with example of violations of 'free speech'. The sub forums within Reddit have plenty examples of violating 'free speech' as well, each political opinion has its own echo chamber on Reddit with anyone expressing alternate opinions swiftly banned. Take r/The_Donald, on a post by the moderators of that subforum that stated their subforum was a "bastion of free speech", many users were banned for expressing different views that did not support Donald Trump in that thread, oh the irony. So as not to appear biased, taking a look at r/LateStageCapitalism (an explicitly anti-capitalist subforum) you will see that you will be banned for attempting to start any form of discussion about the pros of capitalism.

The internet is inherently awful for free speech, in any site there will always be someone, or multiple people in power who can delete comments, easily removing views they disagree with. This means most sites end up as echo chambers, aside from the overly unregulated sites, in which anything may pass - which just means the site ends up a place relatively few people go due to the often disturbing nature of the content.

"Most forms of censorship come to die on the internet" eh? Oh yes, they die at the hands of the mighty army of prepubescent teens in youtube comments or the special snowflakes on Tumblr. One of the most popular social media platforms, if not the most popular - facebook, has been shown to censor certain content, there were various reports during the election of advertisments shown having a clear political bias.

Where I live censorship is part of my experience of the internet, I want to read the local news from a source that isn't controlled by the government? Nope can't do that, I want to read about the quality of human rights where I live? Nope, can't do that. I want to use a social media platform to express my dislike of the ruling family? Sure, I can go ahead and do that, as long as I'm alright with at least a year in prison. My point is that now that the internet is such an integral part of our lives in gathering and sharing information, it has become so much easier to suppress certain opinions and even facts due to the nature of the internet.

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Well it's just that your argument is very factual and you can't really deny facts. I agree that protest certainly is one of the only ways to send a message to the government, so let us protest a̶n̶d̶ ̶m̶a̶y̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶h̶e̶a̶d̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶o̶u̶r̶g̶e̶o̶i̶s̶i̶e̶ ̶r̶o̶l̶l̶!̶